Hi, I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/ Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not be accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you find your proposal in the wrong place. Thanks, Caty On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

*Short version* for voting: *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org

+1

...

*B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: design.xwiki.org incubator.xwiki.org

+1 for design.xwiki.org -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github repository/organization associated to this wiki for example.

...

*C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki (example AppWithinMinutes):

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used.

...

------------------------------------------------ *Long version: *

Right now development process activities are located in multiple places: - Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ - Analysis + User Interface: http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git comments, etc.

This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if you are looking for specific information. And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the items need manual gathering or search.

*Part A. * This mail is about combining

http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and

...

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. This has already been discussed several times before ( http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was favorable in this direction. The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.org that will contain the combined information and that will target developers.

The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific feature/idea/improvement. After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to demonstrate the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case it is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting.

The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki gardening by me.

The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be moved gradually after the new wiki is created.

*Part B. * You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new wiki: - design.xwiki.org - incubator.xwiki.org - we accept other proposals.

*Part C.* I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like:

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

The proposal page will gather all the information related to it, making

it

...

easier to track it's progress.

The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having it's own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will have just the related pages for certain areas. Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space.

The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me.

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Caty _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Hi, On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done!

Some quick comments:

* Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!)

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org. The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

* It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus creation date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should be filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o).

Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so it's normal that they are modified in the past week. I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were created by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925)

* I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of proposals... going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset everything :)

I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for some of them, yes.

* "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For example http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. What about http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLScheme I'm working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard to maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. I'd suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I don't think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about things that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in "Dropped". WDYT?

I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. If you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but the current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want to achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) also a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are really working on. We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' (Not planned). As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order to be accurate.

* Is

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal... "Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"?

I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must have been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' which in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'.

* I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them together, for ex: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene

The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship.

* I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI only... For ex http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLScheme is purely design and you categorized it as "Feature".

For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've tried to pick the easiest ones. 'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set as parent or use the current as feature).

I also don't understand what "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include requirements?

This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have children it will display them. Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it. Thanks, Caty Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't

mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are cycling in small iterations... :)

Thanks! -Vincent

...

Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not be accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you

find

...

your proposal in the wrong place.

Thanks, Caty

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

...

On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

*Short version* for voting: *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org

+1

...

*B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: design.xwiki.org incubator.xwiki.org

+1 for design.xwiki.org -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github repository/organization associated to this wiki for example.

...

*C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki (example AppWithinMinutes):

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used.

...

------------------------------------------------ *Long version: *

Right now development process activities are located in multiple

places:

...

...

- Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ - Analysis + User Interface: http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git comments, etc.

This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if you are looking for specific information. And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the items need manual gathering or search.

*Part A. * This mail is about combining http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. This has already been discussed several times before ( http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was favorable in this direction. The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.org that will contain the combined information and that will target developers.

The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific feature/idea/improvement. After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to demonstrate the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case it is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting.

The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki gardening by me.

The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be moved gradually after the new wiki is created.

*Part B. * You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new wiki: - design.xwiki.org - incubator.xwiki.org - we accept other proposals.

*Part C.* I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like:

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

The proposal page will gather all the information related to it,

making it

...

easier to track it's progress.

The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having it's own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will have just the related pages for certain areas. Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space.

The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me.

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Caty _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Hi Vincent, The idea in my mind was to have centered homepages, just like the Main.WebHome. What I would have liked is to have carousels also on e.x.o, also on design.xwiki.org or any other 'important' pages in order to make it more hub like (promoting important content found on that wiki). For example on e.x.o promoting important extensions or contributors, on design.xwiki.orgpromoting proposals that we might want some feedback, etc. Being an iterative process the carousel content for this wiki is not ready (not even proposed) and it will take some time before I can do it. That was the explanation. Thanks, Caty On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

...

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done!

Some quick comments:

* Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!)

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org . The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

[snip]

I'm sorry but I don't think it's your decision only :) You can't say "I don't want to do it" without any explanations, it's not like it were your own personal wiki (it's used by all committers and visible by everyone)...

Let me give you my rationale:

All the other subwikis are not centered (manager, enterprise, extensions, platform, etc) and there's absolutely no reason to make an exception for the design subwiki. That the main wiki's home page is not centered is ok because it's a special page (the home page of the whole site) and it has some heavily worked UI (a la web site). This is not the case for design.xwiki.org which is more similar to extensions.xwiki.org.

Now if you have some other "rule" that would justify having design.xwiki.orgbe centered please let me know.

Thanks -Vincent _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Hello, Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ..."). 2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]>

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

...

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done!

Some quick comments:

* Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!)

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org. The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

...

* It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus creation date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should be filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o).

Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so it's normal that they are modified in the past week. I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were created by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925)

...

* I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of proposals... going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset everything :)

I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for some of them, yes.

...

* "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For example http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. What about http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard to maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. I'd suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I don't think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about things that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in "Dropped". WDYT?

I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. If you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but the current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want to achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) also a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are really working on.

We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' (Not planned).

As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order to be accurate.

...

* Is

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

...

"Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"?

I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must have been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' which in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'.

...

* I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them together, for ex: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene

The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship.

...

* I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI only... For ex http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLScheme is purely design and you categorized it as "Feature".

For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've tried to pick the easiest ones.

I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org"), considering the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, so it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki " design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes me think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :)

'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set as parent or use the current as feature).

...

I also don't understand what "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include requirements?

This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have children it will display them. Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it.

Thanks, Caty

Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't

...

mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are cycling in small iterations... :)

Thanks! -Vincent

...

Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not be accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark

your

...

proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you find your proposal in the wrong place.

Thanks, Caty

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

...

On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

*Short version* for voting: *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org

+1

...

*B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: design.xwiki.org incubator.xwiki.org

+1 for design.xwiki.org -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github repository/organization associated to this wiki for example.

...

*C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki

(example

...

AppWithinMinutes):

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used.

...

------------------------------------------------ *Long version: *

Right now development process activities are located in multiple

places:

...

...

- Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ - Analysis + User Interface: http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git comments, etc.

This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if you are looking for specific information. And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the items need manual gathering or search.

*Part A. * This mail is about combining http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. This has already been discussed several times before ( http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was favorable in this direction. The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.org that will contain the combined information and that will target developers.

The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific feature/idea/improvement. After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to demonstrate the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case it is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting.

The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki gardening by me.

The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be moved gradually after the new wiki is created.

*Part B. * You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new wiki: - design.xwiki.org - incubator.xwiki.org - we accept other proposals.

*Part C.* I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like:

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

...

The proposal page will gather all the information related to it,

making it

...

easier to track it's progress.

The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having it's own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will have just the related pages for certain areas. Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space.

The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me.

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Caty _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Someone else complained to me about this rights issue too and I couldn't reproduce with my user because I have special rights. On Nov 15, 2013 5:18 PM, "Jeremie BOUSQUET" <[email protected]> wrote:

Hello,

Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ...").

2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]>

...

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

...

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done!

Some quick comments:

* Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!)

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org . The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

...

* It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus creation date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should be filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o).

Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so it's normal that they are modified in the past week. I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were created by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925)

...

* I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of proposals... going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset everything :)

I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for some of them, yes.

...

* "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For example http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. What about http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard to maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. I'd suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I don't think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about things that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in "Dropped". WDYT?

I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. If you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but the current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want to achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) also a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are really working on.

We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' (Not planned).

As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order to be accurate.

...

* Is

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

...

...

"Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"?

I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must have been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' which in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'.

...

* I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them together, for ex: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene

The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship.

...

* I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI only... For ex http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLScheme is purely design and you categorized it as "Feature".

For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've tried to pick the easiest ones.

I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org"), considering the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, so it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki " design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes me think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :)

...

'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set as parent or use the current as feature).

...

I also don't understand what "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include requirements?

This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have children it will display them. Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it.

Thanks, Caty

Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't

...

mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are cycling in small iterations... :)

Thanks! -Vincent

...

Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not

be

...

accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you find your proposal in the wrong place.

Thanks, Caty

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

...

On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

*Short version* for voting: *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org

+1

...

*B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: design.xwiki.org incubator.xwiki.org

+1 for design.xwiki.org -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github repository/organization associated to this wiki for example.

...

*C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki

(example

...

AppWithinMinutes):

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

...

Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as

easy

...

as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used.

...

------------------------------------------------ *Long version: *

Right now development process activities are located in multiple

places:

...

- Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ - Analysis + User Interface: http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git comments, etc.

This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if you are looking for specific information. And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the items need manual gathering or search.

*Part A. * This mail is about combining http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. This has already been discussed several times before ( http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was favorable in this direction. The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.orgthat will contain the combined information and that will target developers.

The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific feature/idea/improvement. After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to demonstrate the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case it is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting.

The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki gardening by me.

The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be moved gradually after the new wiki is created.

*Part B. * You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new wiki: - design.xwiki.org - incubator.xwiki.org - we accept other proposals.

*Part C.* I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like:

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

...

...

The proposal page will gather all the information related to it,

making it

...

easier to track it's progress.

The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having it's own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will have just the related pages for certain areas. Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space.

The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me.

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Caty _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Sounds like "code" css class is broken in that skin (this class is supposed to follow newlines and white spaces like <pre>). On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote:

Another thing, seems now the {{code}} macro puts everything on one line ... (at least, for unauthentified user). Same page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

BR, Jeremie

2013/11/18 Marius Dumitru Florea <[email protected]>

...

Someone else complained to me about this rights issue too and I couldn't reproduce with my user because I have special rights. On Nov 15, 2013 5:18 PM, "Jeremie BOUSQUET" <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Hello,

Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ...").

2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]>

...

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:

...

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done!

Some quick comments:

* Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!)

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org . The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

...

* It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus creation date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should be filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o).

Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so it's normal that they are modified in the past week. I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were created by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925)

...

* I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of proposals... going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset everything :)

I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for some of them, yes.

...

* "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For example http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. What about http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard to maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. I'd suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I don't think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about things that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in "Dropped". WDYT?

I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. If you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but the current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want to achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) also a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are really working on.

We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' (Not planned).

As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order to be accurate.

...

* Is

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

...

...

...

"Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"?

I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must have been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' which in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'.

...

* I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them together, for ex: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene

The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship.

...

* I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI only... For ex http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLScheme is purely design and you categorized it as "Feature".

For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've tried to pick the easiest ones.

I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org"), considering the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, so it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki " design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes me think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :)

...

'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set as parent or use the current as feature).

...

I also don't understand what "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include requirements?

This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have children it will display them. Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it.

Thanks, Caty

Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't

...

mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are cycling in small iterations... :)

Thanks! -Vincent

...

Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might

not be

...

accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you find your proposal in the wrong place.

Thanks, Caty

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

> On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) > <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi, > > > > *Short version* for voting: > > *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development > > process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate > > dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org > > +1 > > > > > *B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: > > design.xwiki.org > > incubator.xwiki.org > > +1 for design.xwiki.org > -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting > to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and > architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github > repository/organization associated to this wiki for example. > > > > > *C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki (example > > AppWithinMinutes): > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

...

> > Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy > as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used. > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > *Long version: * > > > > Right now development process activities are located in multiple places: > > - Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ > > - Analysis + User Interface: > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ > > - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git > > comments, etc. > > > > This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if > > you are looking for specific information. > > And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the > > items need manual gathering or search. > > > > *Part A. * > > This mail is about combining > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. > > This has already been discussed several times before ( > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was > > favorable in this direction. > > The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.orgthat will > > contain the combined information and that will target developers. > > > > The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process > > information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user > > interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific > feature/idea/improvement. > > After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the > > right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). > > It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to > demonstrate > > the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add > > experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case > it > > is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the > > contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting. > > > > The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki > > gardening by me. > > > > The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be > moved > > gradually after the new wiki is created. > > > > *Part B. * > > You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new > > wiki: > > - design.xwiki.org > > - incubator.xwiki.org > > - we accept other proposals. > > > > *Part C.* > > I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like: > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

...

> > > > The proposal page will gather all the information related to it, making > it > > easier to track it's progress. > > > > The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, > > Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having > it's > > own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. > > Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will > have > > just the related pages for certain areas. > > Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space. > > > > The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me. > > > > Let me know what you think. > > Thanks, > > Caty > > _______________________________________________ > > devs mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > > -- > Thomas Mortagne > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

Same issue here ... 2013/11/18 Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>

I configured the design wiki rights like others sub wikis rights.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Sounds like "code" css class is broken in that skin (this class is supposed to follow newlines and white spaces like <pre>).

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Another thing, seems now the {{code}} macro puts everything on one line ... (at least, for unauthentified user). Same page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

BR, Jeremie

2013/11/18 Marius Dumitru Florea <[email protected]>

...

Someone else complained to me about this rights issue too and I couldn't reproduce with my user because I have special rights. On Nov 15, 2013 5:18 PM, "Jeremie BOUSQUET" < [email protected]> wrote:

...

Hello,

Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ...").

2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]>

...

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol < [email protected]> wrote:

> On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < > [email protected]> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I've finished moving the content from > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups > > spaces) to the new wiki > > http://design.xwiki.org/ > > > Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done! > > Some quick comments: > > * Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on other > subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!) >

The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org . The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that.

> * It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus creation > date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should be > filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o). >

Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so it's normal that they are modified in the past week. I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were created by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925)

> * I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of proposals... > going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset everything :) >

I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for some of them, yes.

> * "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For example > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working > actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. What > about http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm > working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard to > maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. I'd > suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I don't > think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about things > that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in "Dropped". > WDYT? >

I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. If you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but the current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want to achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) also a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are really working on.

We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' (Not planned).

As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order to be accurate.

> * Is > >

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

...

...

...

> "Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"? >

I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must have been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' which in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'.

> * I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them > together, for ex: > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene >

The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship.

> * I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI > only... For ex > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeis purely > design and you categorized it as "Feature".

For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've tried to pick the easiest ones.

I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org"), considering the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, so it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki " design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes me think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :)

...

'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set as parent or use the current as feature).

> I also don't understand what > "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include > requirements?

This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have children it will display them. Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it.

Thanks, Caty

Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't > mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are > cycling in small iterations... :) > > Thanks! > -Vincent > > > > > > > > Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not be > > accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your > > proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you > find > > your proposal in the wrong place. > > > > Thanks, > > Caty > > > > > > > > On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > *Short version* for voting: > > > > *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold > > development > > > > process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate > > > > dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org > > > > > > +1 > > > > > > > > > > > *B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: > > > > design.xwiki.org > > > > incubator.xwiki.org > > > > > > +1 for design.xwiki.org > > > -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting > > > to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and > > > architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github > > > repository/organization associated to this wiki for example. > > > > > > > > > > > *C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki (example > > > > AppWithinMinutes): > > > > > > > > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

> > > > > > Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy > > > as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used. > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > *Long version: * > > > > > > > > Right now development process activities are located in multiple > > places: > > > > - Analysis + Architecture: > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ > > > > - Analysis + User Interface: > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ > > > > - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org , chats, > git > > > > comments, etc. > > > > > > > > This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track > > if > > > > you are looking for specific information. > > > > And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of > the > > > > items need manual gathering or search. > > > > > > > > *Part A. * > > > > This mail is about combining > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. > > > > This has already been discussed several times before ( > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was > > > > favorable in this direction. > > > > The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.orgthat > > will > > > > contain the combined information and that will target developers. > > > > > > > > The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development > process > > > > information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user > > > > interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific > > > feature/idea/improvement. > > > > After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in > the > > > > right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). > > > > It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to > > > demonstrate > > > > the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add > > > > experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this > case > > > it > > > > is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use > the > > > > contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting. > > > > > > > > The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki > > > > gardening by me. > > > > > > > > The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org: Design will be > > > moved > > > > gradually after the new wiki is created. > > > > > > > > *Part B. * > > > > You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the > > new > > > > wiki: > > > > - design.xwiki.org > > > > - incubator.xwiki.org > > > > - we accept other proposals. > > > > > > > > *Part C.* > > > > I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like: > > > > > > > > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

...

...

> > > > > > > > The proposal page will gather all the information related to it, > making > > > it > > > > easier to track it's progress. > > > > > > > > The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, > > > > Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having > > > it's > > > > own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. > > > > Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals > will > > > have > > > > just the related pages for certain areas. > > > > Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space. > > > > > > > > The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me. > > > > > > > > Let me know what you think. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Caty > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > devs mailing list > > > > [email protected] > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Thomas Mortagne > > > _______________________________________________ > > > devs mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > devs mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Ok this time it's really ok... There was not existing groups with rights set to them on that wiki. On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote:

I had forgotten one, should be ok now.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Same issue here ...

2013/11/18 Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>

...

I configured the design wiki rights like others sub wikis rights.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Sounds like "code" css class is broken in that skin (this class is supposed to follow newlines and white spaces like <pre>).

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Another thing, seems now the {{code}} macro puts everything on one line ... (at least, for unauthentified user). Same page: http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication

BR, Jeremie

2013/11/18 Marius Dumitru Florea <[email protected]>

...

Someone else complained to me about this rights issue too and I couldn't reproduce with my user because I have special rights. On Nov 15, 2013 5:18 PM, "Jeremie BOUSQUET" < [email protected]> wrote:

> Hello, > > Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this > page: > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication > > If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. > If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You > are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ..."). > > > > 2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> > > > Hi, > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol < [email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I've finished moving the content from > > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups > > > > spaces) to the new wiki > > > > http://design.xwiki.org/ > > > > > > > > > Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done! > > > > > > Some quick comments: > > > > > > * Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on > other > > > subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!) > > > > > > > The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on xwiki.org > . > > The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with > > xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that. > > > > > > > * It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus > > creation > > > date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should > be > > > filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o). > > > > > > > Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. Pages > > on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) so > > it's normal that they are modified in the past week. > > I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have been > > imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were > created > > by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see > > http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925) > > > > > > > * I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of > > proposals... > > > going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset > everything > > :) > > > > > > > I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added > > 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses for > > some of them, yes. > > > > > > > * "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For > example > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working > > > actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. > What > > > about > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm > > > working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too hard > > to > > > maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. > I'd > > > suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I > don't > > > think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about > > things > > > that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in > > "Dropped". > > > WDYT? > > > > > > > I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this app. > If > > you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but > the > > current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', 'Dropped'. > > Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the > > seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want > to > > achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) > also > > a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that feature, > > having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we are > > really working on. > > > > We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a > > certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' > > (Not planned). > > > > As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' > > proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in order > to > > be accurate. > > > > > > > * Is > > > > > > > > >

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

...

> > > "Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"? > > > > > > > I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must > have > > been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' > which > > in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'. > > > > > > > * I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them > > > together, for ex: > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene > > > > > > > The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child relationship. > > > > > > > * I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI > > > only... For ex > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeis > > purely > > > design and you categorized it as "Feature". > > > > > > For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related to > > code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've > > tried to pick the easiest ones. > > > > I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on > (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it > contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org"), > considering > the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, so > it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this > category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki " > design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes > me > think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :) > > > > 'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't > > belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set > as > > parent or use the current as feature). > > > > > > > I also don't understand what > > > "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include > > > requirements? > > > > > > This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related pages > > livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have > children > > it will display them. > > Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it. > > > > Thanks, > > Caty > > > > > > Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't > > > mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and are > > > cycling in small iterations... :) > > > > > > Thanks! > > > -Vincent > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not > be > > > > accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark > > your > > > > proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if > you > > > find > > > > your proposal in the wrong place. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Caty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > *Short version* for voting: > > > > > > *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold > > > > development > > > > > > process details about a specific feature. This wiki will > deprecate > > > > > > dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org > > > > > > > > > > +1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: > > > > > > design.xwiki.org > > > > > > incubator.xwiki.org > > > > > > > > > > +1 for design.xwiki.org > > > > > -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations > > waiting > > > > > to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and > > > > > architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github > > > > > repository/organization associated to this wiki for example. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki > > (example > > > > > > AppWithinMinutes): > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

> > > > > > > > > > Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as > easy > > > > > as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be > used. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > *Long version: * > > > > > > > > > > > > Right now development process activities are located in multiple > > > > places: > > > > > > - Analysis + Architecture: > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ > > > > > > - Analysis + User Interface: > > > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ > > > > > > - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org , > chats, > > > git > > > > > > comments, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to > > track > > > > if > > > > > > you are looking for specific information. > > > > > > And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots > of > > > the > > > > > > items need manual gathering or search. > > > > > > > > > > > > *Part A. * > > > > > > This mail is about combining > > > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and > > > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. > > > > > > This has already been discussed several times before ( > > > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and > > > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote > > was > > > > > > favorable in this direction. > > > > > > The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.orgthat > > > > will > > > > > > contain the combined information and that will target developers. > > > > > > > > > > > > The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development > > > process > > > > > > information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, > > user > > > > > > interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific > > > > > feature/idea/improvement. > > > > > > After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented > in > > > the > > > > > > right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). > > > > > > It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to > > > > > demonstrate > > > > > > the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add > > > > > > experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For > this > > > case > > > > > it > > > > > > is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or > use > > > the > > > > > > contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting. > > > > > > > > > > > > The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the > > wiki > > > > > > gardening by me. > > > > > > > > > > > > The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org: Design > will > > be > > > > > moved > > > > > > gradually after the new wiki is created. > > > > > > > > > > > > *Part B. * > > > > > > You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for > > the > > > > new > > > > > > wiki: > > > > > > - design.xwiki.org > > > > > > - incubator.xwiki.org > > > > > > - we accept other proposals. > > > > > > > > > > > > *Part C.* > > > > > > I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

...

> > > > > > > > > > > > The proposal page will gather all the information related to it, > > > making > > > > > it > > > > > > easier to track it's progress. > > > > > > > > > > > > The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: > Analysis, > > > > > > Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category > > having > > > > > it's > > > > > > own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. > > > > > > Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals > > > will > > > > > have > > > > > > just the related pages for certain areas. > > > > > > Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space. > > > > > > > > > > > > The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me. > > > > > > > > > > > > Let me know what you think. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Caty > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > devs mailing list > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Thomas Mortagne > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > devs mailing list > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > devs mailing list > > > > [email protected] > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > devs mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > devs mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

-- Thomas Mortagne

I think now it's fixed: the {{code}} and edit right problems. Thanks Jeremie for reporting, Caty On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 3:08 PM, Jeremie BOUSQUET < [email protected]> wrote:

It's **almost** ok, now I can view the page when logged in, but I still don't have edit rights ... ;)

2013/11/18 Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>

...

Ok this time it's really ok...

There was not existing groups with rights set to them on that wiki.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote:

...

I had forgotten one, should be ok now.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Same issue here ...

2013/11/18 Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>

...

I configured the design wiki rights like others sub wikis rights.

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote:

...

Sounds like "code" css class is broken in that skin (this class is supposed to follow newlines and white spaces like <pre>).

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Jeremie BOUSQUET <[email protected]> wrote: > Another thing, seems now the {{code}} macro puts everything on one line ... > (at least, for unauthentified user). > Same page: > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication > > BR, > Jeremie > > > 2013/11/18 Marius Dumitru Florea <[email protected]> > >> Someone else complained to me about this rights issue too and I couldn't >> reproduce with my user because I have special rights. >> On Nov 15, 2013 5:18 PM, "Jeremie BOUSQUET" < [email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > Hello, >> > >> > Maybe it's not finished yet or I missed something, but if I browse this >> > page: >> > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/MailArchiveApplication >> > >> > If I'm not authentified, I can see the page. >> > If I log in (in order to edit the page), I can't even see the page ("You >> > are not allowed to view this document or perform this action ..."). >> > >> > >> > >> > 2013/11/15 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> >> > >> > > Hi, >> > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Vincent Massol < [email protected]> >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > > > On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 4:43 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < >> > > > [email protected]> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > Hi, >> > > > > >> > > > > I've finished moving the content from >> > > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and >> > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, >> Mockups >> > > > > spaces) to the new wiki >> > > > > http://design.xwiki.org/ >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Woohoo :) Nice progress from before, well done! >> > > > >> > > > Some quick comments: >> > > > >> > > > * Is it possible to remove the centered thing and do the same as on >> > other >> > > > subwikis of xwiki.org? (consistency!) >> > > > >> > > >> > > The proposal pages are full width just like the other pages on >> xwiki.org >> > . >> > > The only centered page is design:Main.WebHome which is consistent with >> > > xwiki:Main.WebHome. I won't change that. >> > > >> > > >> > > > * It's a real pity that you seem to have lost the history and thus >> > > creation >> > > > date/author and last modified date/author since ideally the LT should >> > be >> > > > filtered by latest proposal first (as for the Extensions of e.x.o). >> > > > >> > > >> > > Just like on e.x.o the livetable is filtered after 'Last modified'. >> Pages >> > > on design.xwiki.org have suffered modifications (objects added, etc.) >> so >> > > it's normal that they are modified in the past week. >> > > I haven't lost the history (except for 4 pages). All the other have >> been >> > > imported with history, but when you look at them you see they were >> > created >> > > by me because that's how we handle import and copy (see >> > > http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-925) >> > > >> > > >> > > > * I think you've been a bit overzeleaous in changing states of >> > > proposals... >> > > > going to try to fix some. At least that's a good way to reset >> > everything >> > > :) >> > > > >> > > >> > > I used scripts: copied the state from old dev:Design space, added >> > > 'completed' state for the incubator pages. I've updated some statuses >> for >> > > some of them, yes. >> > > >> > > >> > > > * "Active" vs "Dormant" is too hard IMO. What's the criteria? For >> > example >> > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/APM Nobody is working >> > > > actively but it's something I believe we need and it's still valid. >> > What >> > > > about >> > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeI'm >> > > > working on it, once every 4 months. I think these 2 states are too >> hard >> > > to >> > > > maintain because nobody is going to move them from Active to Dormant. >> > I'd >> > > > suggest we replace both "Active" and "Dormant" by "Open" because I >> > don't >> > > > think we need to separate them. "Open" should list all designs about >> > > things >> > > > that we wish to do. Those that we don't want to do should be in >> > > "Dropped". >> > > > WDYT? >> > > > >> > > >> > > I have a list with like 5 variants of states we could have for this >> app. >> > If >> > > you really want to have this discussion about the naming we could, but >> > the >> > > current variant is: 'Idea', 'Active', 'Dormant', 'Completed', >> 'Dropped'. >> > > Because we had the discussion about the Status of the project at the >> > > seminar and that is not visible what is on going and what we might want >> > to >> > > achieve, I've added the 2 states. If we are going to add (Not planned) >> > also >> > > a 'Target' column to specify the version we want to release that >> feature, >> > > having an 'Active' state is important since it shows the features we >> are >> > > really working on. >> > > >> > > We could have like a job that listens if a page was not modified for a >> > > certain period of time and change the status from 'Active' to 'Dormant' >> > > (Not planned). >> > > >> > > As mentioned in my early mail I don't really know the status of others' >> > > proposals so that's why I asked of you if you could update them in >> order >> > to >> > > be accurate. >> > > >> > > >> > > > * Is >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >>

http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/CAPTCHAIntegration#Historyreal...

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>> > > > "Dropped"? Shouldn't it be "Completed"? >> > > > >> > > >> > > I haven't changed the Status of this proposal, so this is how it must >> > have >> > > been put by Jerome on devs wiki. Actually the devs status was 'Dead' >> > which >> > > in the new application is marked as 'Dropped'. >> > > >> > > >> > > > * I don't understand how you categorize designs and how you link them >> > > > together, for ex: >> > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/SearchLucene >> > > > >> > > >> > > The proposals are linked together by using the parent/child >> relationship. >> > > >> > > >> > > > * I don't really understand why you consider "Design" to be about UI >> > > > only... For ex >> > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/AlternateURLSchemeis >> > > purely >> > > > design and you categorized it as "Feature". >> > > >> > > >> > > For me what is related to visual aspects is 'Design', what is related >> to >> > > code is 'Implementation'. We could discuss and add more states but I've >> > > tried to pick the easiest ones. >> > > >> > >> > I agree with Vincent, in practice the page about Mail archive I work on >> > (listed above) describes both UI and Code of the app. By the way it >> > contradicts the name of the whole subwiki ("design.xwiki.org "), >> > considering >> > the scope of this subwiki is not limited to proposals on visual aspects, >> so >> > it should not be the same term IMO for the whole subwiki and for this >> > category Design (vs Implementation), or then you should call the subwiki >> " >> > design-and-implementation.xwiki.org" :) . Design vs Implementation makes >> > me >> > think of Architecture vs Code but maybe it's a developer-centric view :) >> > >> > >> > > 'Feature' is used for 'parent' categories and for proposals that don't >> > > belong to any other category (you could create a special page to be set >> > as >> > > parent or use the current as feature). >> > > >> > > >> > > > I also don't understand what >> > > > "Feature'" means. And why a proposal of "Design" cannot include >> > > > requirements? >> > > >> > > >> > > This was a limitation of the application (I was displaying related >> pages >> > > livetable just for Feature proposal), now is fixed. If a page have >> > children >> > > it will display them. >> > > Again if you find something that is misplaced please help me fix it. >> > > >> > > Thanks, >> > > Caty >> > > >> > > >> > > Or is it just the "latest" stage it's in but that doesn't >> > > > mean much in agile dev since the design and code work together and >> are >> > > > cycling in small iterations... :) >> > > > >> > > > Thanks! >> > > > -Vincent >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might >> not >> > be >> > > > > accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to >> mark >> > > your >> > > > > proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if >> > you >> > > > find >> > > > > your proposal in the wrong place. >> > > > > >> > > > > Thanks, >> > > > > Caty >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne >> > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) >> > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: >> > > > > > > Hi, >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *Short version* for voting: >> > > > > > > *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold >> > > > > development >> > > > > > > process details about a specific feature. This wiki will >> > deprecate >> > > > > > > dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org >> > > > > > >> > > > > > +1 >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: >> > > > > > > design.xwiki.org >> > > > > > > incubator.xwiki.org >> > > > > > >> > > > > > +1 for design.xwiki.org >> > > > > > -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations >> > > waiting >> > > > > > to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design >> and >> > > > > > architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a >> github >> > > > > > repository/organization associated to this wiki for example. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki >> > > (example >> > > > > > > AppWithinMinutes): >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >>

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

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>> > > > > > >> > > > > > Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as >> > easy >> > > > > > as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be >> > used. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ >> > > > > > > *Long version: * >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Right now development process activities are located in >> multiple >> > > > > places: >> > > > > > > - Analysis + Architecture: >> > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ >> > > > > > > - Analysis + User Interface: >> > > > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ >> > > > > > > - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org , >> > chats, >> > > > git >> > > > > > > comments, etc. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to >> > > track >> > > > > if >> > > > > > > you are looking for specific information. >> > > > > > > And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots >> > of >> > > > the >> > > > > > > items need manual gathering or search. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *Part A. * >> > > > > > > This mail is about combining >> > > > > > http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and >> > > > > > > http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. >> > > > > > > This has already been discussed several times before ( >> > > > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6sand >> > > > > > > http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the >> vote >> > > was >> > > > > > > favorable in this direction. >> > > > > > > The proposal was to create a new wiki called >> design.xwiki.orgthat >> > > > > will >> > > > > > > contain the combined information and that will target >> developers. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development >> > > > process >> > > > > > > information: requirements, architecture, solutions >> alternatives, >> > > user >> > > > > > > interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific >> > > > > > feature/idea/improvement. >> > > > > > > After the proposal is implemented it will be properly >> documented >> > in >> > > > the >> > > > > > > right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). >> > > > > > > It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to >> > > > > > demonstrate >> > > > > > > the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add >> > > > > > > experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For >> > this >> > > > case >> > > > > > it >> > > > > > > is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or >> > use >> > > > the >> > > > > > > contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and >> the >> > > wiki >> > > > > > > gardening by me. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org: Design >> > will >> > > be >> > > > > > moved >> > > > > > > gradually after the new wiki is created. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *Part B. * >> > > > > > > You should state your opinion regarding which name is better >> for >> > > the >> > > > > new >> > > > > > > wiki: >> > > > > > > - design.xwiki.org >> > > > > > > - incubator.xwiki.org >> > > > > > > - we accept other proposals. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > *Part C.* >> > > > > > > I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like: >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >>

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

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>> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The proposal page will gather all the information related to >> it, >> > > > making >> > > > > > it >> > > > > > > easier to track it's progress. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: >> > Analysis, >> > > > > > > Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category >> > > having >> > > > > > it's >> > > > > > > own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. >> > > > > > > Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller >> proposals >> > > > will >> > > > > > have >> > > > > > > just the related pages for certain areas. >> > > > > > > Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Let me know what you think. >> > > > > > > Thanks, >> > > > > > > Caty >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > > > > devs mailing list >> > > > > > > [email protected] >> > > > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > -- >> > > > > > Thomas Mortagne >> > > > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > > > devs mailing list >> > > > > > [email protected] >> > > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > > > > > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > > devs mailing list >> > > > > [email protected] >> > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > devs mailing list >> > > > [email protected] >> > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > devs mailing list >> > > [email protected] >> > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > devs mailing list >> > [email protected] >> > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> devs mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs >> > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

It's very nice to have all technical and design proposals in once space and the new features added like related proposals and mail links are really cool. A pass on the tags could be nice to have them have a better value for browing proposals. Ludovic 2013/11/13 Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]>

Hi,

I've finished moving the content from http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/WebHome and http://incubator.myxwiki.org (Improvements, Standards, Tech, Mockups spaces) to the new wiki http://design.xwiki.org/

Since I've been using scripts, the Participants and Status might not be accurate since I marked most of them as Completed. Feel free to mark your proposal accordingly and maybe even change the parent hierarchy if you find your proposal in the wrong place.

Thanks, Caty

On Sat, Nov 5, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>wrote:

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On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> wrote:

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Hi,

*Short version* for voting: *A*. Creation of a new wiki on xwiki.org farm that will hold development process details about a specific feature. This wiki will deprecate dev.xwiki.org:Design and incubator.myxwiki.org

+1

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*B*. Vote on naming alternatives for this new wiki: design.xwiki.org incubator.xwiki.org

+1 for design.xwiki.org -0 for incubator.xwiki.org, "incubator" means implementations waiting to be approved in some mainstream repository for me not design and architecture. It would make more sense used as the name of a github repository/organization associated to this wiki for example.

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*C*. UI on how a Proposal will be displayed in this new wiki (example AppWithinMinutes):

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

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Looks very nice. Same as Denis, it's very important that it's as easy as possible to use and not a constraint in order to actually be used.

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------------------------------------------------ *Long version: *

Right now development process activities are located in multiple

places:

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- Analysis + Architecture: http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/ - Analysis + User Interface: http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ - Other: http://xwiki.markmail.org/, http://jira.xwiki.org, chats, git comments, etc.

This process can be hard to optimize and information is hard to track if you are looking for specific information. And the worst part of it is that is hard to automatize and lots of the items need manual gathering or search.

*Part A. * This mail is about combining http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Design/and http://incubator.myxwiki.org/ work in a single place. This has already been discussed several times before ( http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/kc32dufsf7nyyt6s and http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/izj6aiyodwqia4vl) and the vote was favorable in this direction. The proposal was to create a new wiki called design.xwiki.org that will contain the combined information and that will target developers.

The new wiki will be used to gather only proposal's development process information: requirements, architecture, solutions alternatives, user interface variants, planning, etc. for a specific feature/idea/improvement. After the proposal is implemented it will be properly documented in the right location for users (ex platform.xwiki.org). It is acceptable to have CSS + JS code on this wiki in order to demonstrate the functionality of the proposals, but we should not add experimental/dangerous code (groovy scripts, jars, etc.). For this case it is advisable to use a test machine, share your own instance or use the contrib.xwiki.org repository for hosting.

The version upgrades will be handle by a community admin and the wiki gardening by me.

The data from incubator.myxwiki.org and dev.xwiki.org:Design will be moved gradually after the new wiki is created.

*Part B. * You should state your opinion regarding which name is better for the new wiki: - design.xwiki.org - incubator.xwiki.org - we accept other proposals.

*Part C.* I've made a proposal on how a proposal page would look like:

http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/XWikiOrgDesignWiki

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The proposal page will gather all the information related to it, making

it

...

easier to track it's progress.

The entries will be separated depending on 4 categories: Analysis, Architecture, User Interface and Implementation, each category having it's own status, participants, jiras and timeframe. Categories are not mandatory for all proposals, smaller proposals will have just the related pages for certain areas. Each proposal will store it's data in a dedicated space.

The implementation of the proposal will be handled by me.

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Caty _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Thomas Mortagne _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

-- Ludovic Dubost Founder and CEO Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/ XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost