Re: [xwiki-devs] [xwiki-users] Re-organize the Drawer's entries
Hi Guillaume, Thanks for starting this thread. ---------------------------------------------------------- Current Drawer analysis: Languages ( L / G ) --- Home ( G ) [N] --- Administer wiki ( L ) [A] [W] --- Wiki Index ( G ) [I] [W] Page Index ( L ) [I] User Index ( L / G ) [I] Applications Index ( L) [I] --- Create wiki ( G ) [A] [W] --- Delete wiki ( L ) [A] [W] L = Local/Wiki setting/action/effect G = Global/Farm setting/action/effect N = Navigation A = Action W = Wiki entity ---------------------------------------------------------- Some examples of grouping: 1. Local / Global effect grouping (ex. Main/Subwiki actions should be grouped) 2. Entities grouping (Wiki related actions should be grouped: create, administer, delete, etc.) 3. Index grouping (group all index applications together) 4. Navigation grouping (to Main wiki or other wikis) 5. Actions grouping 6. other? So the main question is what grouping would we want to prioritize first: 1-5? ---------------------------------------------------------- Some things to consider: A. Naming consistency: A1. Across wiki: we need to consider the terms usage. For example Home vs. Homepage; Wiki vs. Subwiki; Settings vs. Administration; Wiki Index vs. Browse all wikis vs. Show all wikis -- We need to align these usages and pick the one most relevant for the end user and correct as terminology A2. Across the menu: this implies having all entries plural/singular or having the same additional text (ex. do we mark Indexes the same way? Administer wiki / Delete this wiki / Create a new wiki, etc.) B. Explicit (vs. Cryptic) -- how explicit should we make the labels vs. icons usage C. Quick access to local actions -- in subwikis we should optimize for local actions and try to display them first, since some teams might have dedicated wikis and the main wiki could be used just as a portal or as a farm D. Order most used actions first -- for example 'Delete wiki' is not a very used action E. Navigation vs. Actions grouping E1. Actions removal -- for example we could even remove 'Delete wiki' action and consider that the wiki management actions can be accessed just from Wiki Index -- this would mean that 'Administrate wiki' would be removed too, and we use that action a lot in the initial configuration phases, so that would increase the time to reach Administration E2. Adding more wiki navigation -- For example http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12538 talks about having a way to add quick access to other subwikis (ideally as favorites, since listing all wikis does not scale) ---------------------------------------------------------- Proposals grouping feedback: Current. -1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P1. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), partial 5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P2. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), partial 3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P3. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P4. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), partial C (Quick access) ---------------------------------------------------------- The problem is that when you approach an usability problem using these kind of grouping / grading it's very easy to fall in the 'technicalities' trap and not think about the user perspective. So although I understand why I proposed P1-4, for users it will not make sense. That's why I like P5, because the grouping comes natural and is more explicit, although is not using the consistent terminology. P5: +1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), -3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || -A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), +B (Explicit), +C (Quick access to local), ? D (Most used actions) Things to fix for P5: - Think where to fit the "Languages" - A1 + A2: we need to think about the naming of Indexes (especially Wiki Index in this case) and fix them in drawer and across; replace Settings with Administration; fix the "Go to ..."; consistent actions naming. Additionally we should fix A1 (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-9363) ---------------------------------------------------------- Before starting this thread I tried to rethink about a new solution and I came up with P6: -1 (Local/Global), +2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), +4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), -B (Cryptic/Iconography), -C (Quick access), ? D (Most used actions), +E2 (More navigation) i) Having Indexes listed before local actions (will give a -C for quick access), but the advantage is that the menu composition will change less if we visit main wiki vs. subwikis. P5 also have this propety. ii) I've grouped and added more navigation by providing the list of wikis. There are several problems with this approach: ii.1 - not scalable for large number of wikis (even though I've put an accordion there) ii.2 - cryptic actions (icon usage for Create, Administration, Delete wiki) ii.3 - mobile issues (because the icons are very small and we will need a different layout for mobiles or we might have problems with large wiki names) ---------------------------------------------------------- Thanks, Caty On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Miroslav Galajda < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi, I vote for P5 proposal.
Mirec
On 26 October 2016 at 10:28, Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]> wrote:
No opinion?
2016-10-24 18:09 GMT+02:00 Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]>:
Hello dear developers and XWiki users.
I would you to take a look at the issue http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-13070.
The problem is that the current order (that I have implemented based on my intuition) seems to not be clear for our users. The main point is that the menu mixes up global items (Home wiki, Wiki Index) and local ones (Administer Wiki, Page Index, Delete wiki, etc...).
Caty and Oliver have made some proposals that you could find in the issue.
They are called P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.
I propose you to express your preferences so we can implement it based on a consensus.
Here are mine:
P1: There is a logical order and separation between item. However, it seems the more used actions (Wiki Index, Page Index) are less visible than some other (Delete Wiki, Create Wiki...)
P2: The order and the separation are logic. The "delete wiki" action is still very visible but all other items are good.
P3: Same than P2. Except that having "Wiki Index" along with "User, Page and Application Index" mixes up local and global items.
P4: Why not, but maybe the 3 first actions should be placed after the other ones, since they would be less used. Same remark about the mixing of local and global items.
P5: A clear distinction between local and global scope. More used items are located first. This is my favorite one.
So +1 for P5, +0 for the other options so far.
Now, what about you?
Thanks, Guillaume
PS: I send this message to both devs and users mailing lists, because I think users are directly concerned by this topic.
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
P6: http://jira.xwiki.org/secure/attachment/33161/P6.png On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi Guillaume,
Thanks for starting this thread.
---------------------------------------------------------- Current Drawer analysis:
Languages ( L / G ) --- Home ( G ) [N] --- Administer wiki ( L ) [A] [W] --- Wiki Index ( G ) [I] [W] Page Index ( L ) [I] User Index ( L / G ) [I] Applications Index ( L) [I] --- Create wiki ( G ) [A] [W] --- Delete wiki ( L ) [A] [W]
L = Local/Wiki setting/action/effect G = Global/Farm setting/action/effect
N = Navigation A = Action W = Wiki entity
----------------------------------------------------------
Some examples of grouping: 1. Local / Global effect grouping (ex. Main/Subwiki actions should be grouped) 2. Entities grouping (Wiki related actions should be grouped: create, administer, delete, etc.) 3. Index grouping (group all index applications together) 4. Navigation grouping (to Main wiki or other wikis) 5. Actions grouping 6. other?
So the main question is what grouping would we want to prioritize first: 1-5?
----------------------------------------------------------
Some things to consider: A. Naming consistency: A1. Across wiki: we need to consider the terms usage. For example Home vs. Homepage; Wiki vs. Subwiki; Settings vs. Administration; Wiki Index vs. Browse all wikis vs. Show all wikis -- We need to align these usages and pick the one most relevant for the end user and correct as terminology A2. Across the menu: this implies having all entries plural/singular or having the same additional text (ex. do we mark Indexes the same way? Administer wiki / Delete this wiki / Create a new wiki, etc.)
B. Explicit (vs. Cryptic) -- how explicit should we make the labels vs. icons usage
C. Quick access to local actions -- in subwikis we should optimize for local actions and try to display them first, since some teams might have dedicated wikis and the main wiki could be used just as a portal or as a farm
D. Order most used actions first -- for example 'Delete wiki' is not a very used action
E. Navigation vs. Actions grouping E1. Actions removal -- for example we could even remove 'Delete wiki' action and consider that the wiki management actions can be accessed just from Wiki Index -- this would mean that 'Administrate wiki' would be removed too, and we use that action a lot in the initial configuration phases, so that would increase the time to reach Administration E2. Adding more wiki navigation -- For example http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12538 talks about having a way to add quick access to other subwikis (ideally as favorites, since listing all wikis does not scale)
----------------------------------------------------------
Proposals grouping feedback: Current. -1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P1. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), partial 5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P2. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), partial 3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P3. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P4. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), partial C (Quick access)
----------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that when you approach an usability problem using these kind of grouping / grading it's very easy to fall in the 'technicalities' trap and not think about the user perspective.
So although I understand why I proposed P1-4, for users it will not make sense. That's why I like P5, because the grouping comes natural and is more explicit, although is not using the consistent terminology.
P5: +1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), -3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || -A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), +B (Explicit), +C (Quick access to local), ? D (Most used actions)
Things to fix for P5: - Think where to fit the "Languages" - A1 + A2: we need to think about the naming of Indexes (especially Wiki Index in this case) and fix them in drawer and across; replace Settings with Administration; fix the "Go to ..."; consistent actions naming.
Additionally we should fix A1 (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-9363 )
----------------------------------------------------------
Before starting this thread I tried to rethink about a new solution and I came up with P6: -1 (Local/Global), +2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), +4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), -B (Cryptic/Iconography), -C (Quick access), ? D (Most used actions), +E2 (More navigation)
i) Having Indexes listed before local actions (will give a -C for quick access), but the advantage is that the menu composition will change less if we visit main wiki vs. subwikis. P5 also have this propety.
ii) I've grouped and added more navigation by providing the list of wikis. There are several problems with this approach: ii.1 - not scalable for large number of wikis (even though I've put an accordion there) ii.2 - cryptic actions (icon usage for Create, Administration, Delete wiki) ii.3 - mobile issues (because the icons are very small and we will need a different layout for mobiles or we might have problems with large wiki names)
----------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Caty
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Miroslav Galajda < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi, I vote for P5 proposal.
Mirec
On 26 October 2016 at 10:28, Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]> wrote:
No opinion?
2016-10-24 18:09 GMT+02:00 Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]>:
Hello dear developers and XWiki users.
I would you to take a look at the issue http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-13070.
The problem is that the current order (that I have implemented based on my intuition) seems to not be clear for our users. The main point is that the menu mixes up global items (Home wiki, Wiki Index) and local ones (Administer Wiki, Page Index, Delete wiki, etc...).
Caty and Oliver have made some proposals that you could find in the issue.
They are called P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.
I propose you to express your preferences so we can implement it based on a consensus.
Here are mine:
P1: There is a logical order and separation between item. However, it seems the more used actions (Wiki Index, Page Index) are less visible than some other (Delete Wiki, Create Wiki...)
P2: The order and the separation are logic. The "delete wiki" action is still very visible but all other items are good.
P3: Same than P2. Except that having "Wiki Index" along with "User, Page and Application Index" mixes up local and global items.
P4: Why not, but maybe the 3 first actions should be placed after the other ones, since they would be less used. Same remark about the mixing of local and global items.
P5: A clear distinction between local and global scope. More used items are located first. This is my favorite one.
So +1 for P5, +0 for the other options so far.
Now, what about you?
Thanks, Guillaume
PS: I send this message to both devs and users mailing lists, because I think users are directly concerned by this topic.
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
The Navigation additions of P6 are better suited for Wiki Index application, than the Drawer. So from what we currently have P5 looks like the better candidate (if nobody else has any other suggestions) (and because of its focus on local actions), but we need to fix the naming inconsistencies. Thanks, Caty On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:34 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
P6: http://jira.xwiki.org/secure/attachment/33161/P6.png
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi Guillaume,
Thanks for starting this thread.
---------------------------------------------------------- Current Drawer analysis:
Languages ( L / G ) --- Home ( G ) [N] --- Administer wiki ( L ) [A] [W] --- Wiki Index ( G ) [I] [W] Page Index ( L ) [I] User Index ( L / G ) [I] Applications Index ( L) [I] --- Create wiki ( G ) [A] [W] --- Delete wiki ( L ) [A] [W]
L = Local/Wiki setting/action/effect G = Global/Farm setting/action/effect
N = Navigation A = Action W = Wiki entity
----------------------------------------------------------
Some examples of grouping: 1. Local / Global effect grouping (ex. Main/Subwiki actions should be grouped) 2. Entities grouping (Wiki related actions should be grouped: create, administer, delete, etc.) 3. Index grouping (group all index applications together) 4. Navigation grouping (to Main wiki or other wikis) 5. Actions grouping 6. other?
So the main question is what grouping would we want to prioritize first: 1-5?
----------------------------------------------------------
Some things to consider: A. Naming consistency: A1. Across wiki: we need to consider the terms usage. For example Home vs. Homepage; Wiki vs. Subwiki; Settings vs. Administration; Wiki Index vs. Browse all wikis vs. Show all wikis -- We need to align these usages and pick the one most relevant for the end user and correct as terminology A2. Across the menu: this implies having all entries plural/singular or having the same additional text (ex. do we mark Indexes the same way? Administer wiki / Delete this wiki / Create a new wiki, etc.)
B. Explicit (vs. Cryptic) -- how explicit should we make the labels vs. icons usage
C. Quick access to local actions -- in subwikis we should optimize for local actions and try to display them first, since some teams might have dedicated wikis and the main wiki could be used just as a portal or as a farm
D. Order most used actions first -- for example 'Delete wiki' is not a very used action
E. Navigation vs. Actions grouping E1. Actions removal -- for example we could even remove 'Delete wiki' action and consider that the wiki management actions can be accessed just from Wiki Index -- this would mean that 'Administrate wiki' would be removed too, and we use that action a lot in the initial configuration phases, so that would increase the time to reach Administration E2. Adding more wiki navigation -- For example http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12538 talks about having a way to add quick access to other subwikis (ideally as favorites, since listing all wikis does not scale)
----------------------------------------------------------
Proposals grouping feedback: Current. -1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P1. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), partial 5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P2. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), partial 3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P3. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P4. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), partial C (Quick access)
----------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that when you approach an usability problem using these kind of grouping / grading it's very easy to fall in the 'technicalities' trap and not think about the user perspective.
So although I understand why I proposed P1-4, for users it will not make sense. That's why I like P5, because the grouping comes natural and is more explicit, although is not using the consistent terminology.
P5: +1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), -3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || -A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), +B (Explicit), +C (Quick access to local), ? D (Most used actions)
Things to fix for P5: - Think where to fit the "Languages" - A1 + A2: we need to think about the naming of Indexes (especially Wiki Index in this case) and fix them in drawer and across; replace Settings with Administration; fix the "Go to ..."; consistent actions naming.
Additionally we should fix A1 (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/X WIKI-9363)
----------------------------------------------------------
Before starting this thread I tried to rethink about a new solution and I came up with P6: -1 (Local/Global), +2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), +4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), -B (Cryptic/Iconography), -C (Quick access), ? D (Most used actions), +E2 (More navigation)
i) Having Indexes listed before local actions (will give a -C for quick access), but the advantage is that the menu composition will change less if we visit main wiki vs. subwikis. P5 also have this propety.
ii) I've grouped and added more navigation by providing the list of wikis. There are several problems with this approach: ii.1 - not scalable for large number of wikis (even though I've put an accordion there) ii.2 - cryptic actions (icon usage for Create, Administration, Delete wiki) ii.3 - mobile issues (because the icons are very small and we will need a different layout for mobiles or we might have problems with large wiki names)
----------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Caty
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Miroslav Galajda < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi, I vote for P5 proposal.
Mirec
On 26 October 2016 at 10:28, Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]> wrote:
No opinion?
2016-10-24 18:09 GMT+02:00 Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]>:
Hello dear developers and XWiki users.
I would you to take a look at the issue http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-13070.
The problem is that the current order (that I have implemented based on my intuition) seems to not be clear for our users. The main point is that the menu mixes up global items (Home wiki, Wiki Index) and local ones (Administer Wiki, Page Index, Delete wiki, etc...).
Caty and Oliver have made some proposals that you could find in the issue.
They are called P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.
I propose you to express your preferences so we can implement it based on a consensus.
Here are mine:
P1: There is a logical order and separation between item. However, it seems the more used actions (Wiki Index, Page Index) are less visible than some other (Delete Wiki, Create Wiki...)
P2: The order and the separation are logic. The "delete wiki" action is still very visible but all other items are good.
P3: Same than P2. Except that having "Wiki Index" along with "User, Page and Application Index" mixes up local and global items.
P4: Why not, but maybe the 3 first actions should be placed after the other ones, since they would be less used. Same remark about the mixing of local and global items.
P5: A clear distinction between local and global scope. More used items are located first. This is my favorite one.
So +1 for P5, +0 for the other options so far.
Now, what about you?
Thanks, Guillaume
PS: I send this message to both devs and users mailing lists, because I think users are directly concerned by this topic.
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi Guillaume,
Thanks for starting this thread.
---------------------------------------------------------- Current Drawer analysis:
Languages ( L / G ) --- Home ( G ) [N] --- Administer wiki ( L ) [A] [W] --- Wiki Index ( G ) [I] [W] Page Index ( L ) [I] User Index ( L / G ) [I] Applications Index ( L) [I] --- Create wiki ( G ) [A] [W] --- Delete wiki ( L ) [A] [W]
L = Local/Wiki setting/action/effect G = Global/Farm setting/action/effect
N = Navigation A = Action W = Wiki entity
----------------------------------------------------------
Some examples of grouping: 1. Local / Global effect grouping (ex. Main/Subwiki actions should be grouped) 2. Entities grouping (Wiki related actions should be grouped: create, administer, delete, etc.) 3. Index grouping (group all index applications together) 4. Navigation grouping (to Main wiki or other wikis) 5. Actions grouping 6. other?
So the main question is what grouping would we want to prioritize first: 1-5?
----------------------------------------------------------
Some things to consider: A. Naming consistency:
A1. Across wiki: we need to consider the terms usage. For example Home vs. Homepage; Wiki vs. Subwiki; Settings vs. Administration; Wiki Index vs. Browse all wikis vs. Show all wikis -- We need to align these usages and pick the one most relevant for the end user and correct as terminology
+1, Pages/Users/Applications is not consistent with "Show all wikis" in P5. Using simply "Wikis" would be more consistent.
A2. Across the menu: this implies having all entries plural/singular or having the same additional text (ex. do we mark Indexes the same way? Administer wiki / Delete this wiki / Create a new wiki, etc.)
B. Explicit (vs. Cryptic) -- how explicit should we make the labels vs. icons usage
C. Quick access to local actions -- in subwikis we should optimize for local actions and try to display them first, since some teams might have dedicated wikis and the main wiki could be used just as a portal or as a farm
D. Order most used actions first -- for example 'Delete wiki' is not a very used action
E. Navigation vs. Actions grouping E1. Actions removal
-- for example we could even remove 'Delete wiki' action and consider that the wiki management actions can be accessed just from Wiki Index
+1. I would also remove Create Wiki. A single entry to "Manage Wikis" where you can view, create and delete wikis is better IMO.
-- this would mean that 'Administrate wiki' would be removed too, and we use that action a lot in the initial configuration phases, so that would increase the time to reach Administration
-1 wiki administration is a very common action for admins. Thanks, Marius
E2. Adding more wiki navigation -- For example http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12538 talks about having a way to add quick access to other subwikis (ideally as favorites, since listing all wikis does not scale)
----------------------------------------------------------
Proposals grouping feedback: Current. -1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P1. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), partial 5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P2. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), partial 3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P3. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P4. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), partial C (Quick access)
----------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that when you approach an usability problem using these kind of grouping / grading it's very easy to fall in the 'technicalities' trap and not think about the user perspective.
So although I understand why I proposed P1-4, for users it will not make sense. That's why I like P5, because the grouping comes natural and is more explicit, although is not using the consistent terminology.
P5: +1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), -3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || -A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), +B (Explicit), +C (Quick access to local), ? D (Most used actions)
Things to fix for P5: - Think where to fit the "Languages" - A1 + A2: we need to think about the naming of Indexes (especially Wiki Index in this case) and fix them in drawer and across; replace Settings with Administration; fix the "Go to ..."; consistent actions naming.
Additionally we should fix A1 (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-9363 )
----------------------------------------------------------
Before starting this thread I tried to rethink about a new solution and I came up with P6: -1 (Local/Global), +2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), +4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), -B (Cryptic/Iconography), -C (Quick access), ? D (Most used actions), +E2 (More navigation)
i) Having Indexes listed before local actions (will give a -C for quick access), but the advantage is that the menu composition will change less if we visit main wiki vs. subwikis. P5 also have this propety.
ii) I've grouped and added more navigation by providing the list of wikis. There are several problems with this approach: ii.1 - not scalable for large number of wikis (even though I've put an accordion there) ii.2 - cryptic actions (icon usage for Create, Administration, Delete wiki) ii.3 - mobile issues (because the icons are very small and we will need a different layout for mobiles or we might have problems with large wiki names)
----------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Caty
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Miroslav Galajda < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi, I vote for P5 proposal.
Mirec
On 26 October 2016 at 10:28, Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]> wrote:
No opinion?
2016-10-24 18:09 GMT+02:00 Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]>:
Hello dear developers and XWiki users.
I would you to take a look at the issue http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-13070.
The problem is that the current order (that I have implemented based on my intuition) seems to not be clear for our users. The main point is that the menu mixes up global items (Home wiki, Wiki Index) and local ones (Administer Wiki, Page Index, Delete wiki, etc...).
Caty and Oliver have made some proposals that you could find in the issue.
They are called P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.
I propose you to express your preferences so we can implement it based on a consensus.
Here are mine:
P1: There is a logical order and separation between item. However, it seems the more used actions (Wiki Index, Page Index) are less visible than some other (Delete Wiki, Create Wiki...)
P2: The order and the separation are logic. The "delete wiki" action is still very visible but all other items are good.
P3: Same than P2. Except that having "Wiki Index" along with "User, Page and Application Index" mixes up local and global items.
P4: Why not, but maybe the 3 first actions should be placed after the other ones, since they would be less used. Same remark about the mixing of local and global items.
P5: A clear distinction between local and global scope. More used items are located first. This is my favorite one.
So +1 for P5, +0 for the other options so far.
Now, what about you?
Thanks, Guillaume
PS: I send this message to both devs and users mailing lists, because I think users are directly concerned by this topic.
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
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Thanks for your ideas. Any other? 2016-10-31 10:21 GMT+01:00 Marius Dumitru Florea < [email protected]>:
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi Guillaume,
Thanks for starting this thread.
---------------------------------------------------------- Current Drawer analysis:
Languages ( L / G ) --- Home ( G ) [N] --- Administer wiki ( L ) [A] [W] --- Wiki Index ( G ) [I] [W] Page Index ( L ) [I] User Index ( L / G ) [I] Applications Index ( L) [I] --- Create wiki ( G ) [A] [W] --- Delete wiki ( L ) [A] [W]
L = Local/Wiki setting/action/effect G = Global/Farm setting/action/effect
N = Navigation A = Action W = Wiki entity
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Some examples of grouping: 1. Local / Global effect grouping (ex. Main/Subwiki actions should be grouped) 2. Entities grouping (Wiki related actions should be grouped: create, administer, delete, etc.) 3. Index grouping (group all index applications together) 4. Navigation grouping (to Main wiki or other wikis) 5. Actions grouping 6. other?
So the main question is what grouping would we want to prioritize first: 1-5?
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Some things to consider: A. Naming consistency:
A1. Across wiki: we need to consider the terms usage. For example Home vs. Homepage; Wiki vs. Subwiki; Settings vs. Administration; Wiki Index vs. Browse all wikis vs. Show all wikis -- We need to align these usages and pick the one most relevant for the end user and correct as terminology
+1, Pages/Users/Applications is not consistent with "Show all wikis" in P5. Using simply "Wikis" would be more consistent.
A2. Across the menu: this implies having all entries plural/singular or having the same additional text (ex. do we mark Indexes the same way? Administer wiki / Delete this wiki / Create a new wiki, etc.)
B. Explicit (vs. Cryptic) -- how explicit should we make the labels vs. icons usage
C. Quick access to local actions -- in subwikis we should optimize for local actions and try to display them first, since some teams might have dedicated wikis and the main wiki could be used just as a portal or as a farm
D. Order most used actions first -- for example 'Delete wiki' is not a very used action
E. Navigation vs. Actions grouping E1. Actions removal
-- for example we could even remove 'Delete wiki' action and consider that the wiki management actions can be accessed just from Wiki Index
+1. I would also remove Create Wiki. A single entry to "Manage Wikis" where you can view, create and delete wikis is better IMO.
-- this would mean that 'Administrate wiki' would be removed too, and we use that action a lot in the initial configuration phases, so that would increase the time to reach Administration
-1 wiki administration is a very common action for admins.
Thanks, Marius
E2. Adding more wiki navigation -- For example http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12538 talks about having a way to add quick access to other subwikis (ideally as favorites, since listing all wikis does not scale)
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Proposals grouping feedback: Current. -1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P1. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), partial 5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -C (Quick access) P2. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), partial 3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P3. partial 1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), +C (Quick access) P4. -1 (Local/Global), partial 2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), -4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), partial C (Quick access)
----------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that when you approach an usability problem using these kind of grouping / grading it's very easy to fall in the 'technicalities' trap and not think about the user perspective.
So although I understand why I proposed P1-4, for users it will not make sense. That's why I like P5, because the grouping comes natural and is more explicit, although is not using the consistent terminology.
P5: +1 (Local/Global), -2 (Wiki grouping), -3 (Indexes), partial 4 (Navigation), -5 (Actions) || -A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), +B (Explicit), +C (Quick access to local), ? D (Most used actions)
Things to fix for P5: - Think where to fit the "Languages" - A1 + A2: we need to think about the naming of Indexes (especially Wiki Index in this case) and fix them in drawer and across; replace Settings with Administration; fix the "Go to ..."; consistent actions naming.
Additionally we should fix A1 (see http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-9363 )
----------------------------------------------------------
Before starting this thread I tried to rethink about a new solution and I came up with P6: -1 (Local/Global), +2 (Wiki grouping), +3 (Indexes), +4 (Navigation), +5 (Actions) || +A2 (Naming consistency), -A1 (Across wiki), -B (Cryptic/Iconography), -C (Quick access), ? D (Most used actions), +E2 (More navigation)
i) Having Indexes listed before local actions (will give a -C for quick access), but the advantage is that the menu composition will change less if we visit main wiki vs. subwikis. P5 also have this propety.
ii) I've grouped and added more navigation by providing the list of wikis. There are several problems with this approach: ii.1 - not scalable for large number of wikis (even though I've put an accordion there) ii.2 - cryptic actions (icon usage for Create, Administration, Delete wiki) ii.3 - mobile issues (because the icons are very small and we will need a different layout for mobiles or we might have problems with large wiki names)
----------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Caty
On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Miroslav Galajda < [email protected]> wrote:
Hi, I vote for P5 proposal.
Mirec
On 26 October 2016 at 10:28, Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]> wrote:
No opinion?
2016-10-24 18:09 GMT+02:00 Guillaume Delhumeau < [email protected]>:
Hello dear developers and XWiki users.
I would you to take a look at the issue http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/ XWIKI-13070.
The problem is that the current order (that I have implemented based on my intuition) seems to not be clear for our users. The main point is that the menu mixes up global items (Home wiki, Wiki Index) and local ones (Administer Wiki, Page Index, Delete wiki, etc...).
Caty and Oliver have made some proposals that you could find in the issue.
They are called P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.
I propose you to express your preferences so we can implement it based on a consensus.
Here are mine:
P1: There is a logical order and separation between item. However, it seems the more used actions (Wiki Index, Page Index) are less visible than some other (Delete Wiki, Create Wiki...)
P2: The order and the separation are logic. The "delete wiki" action is still very visible but all other items are good.
P3: Same than P2. Except that having "Wiki Index" along with "User, Page and Application Index" mixes up local and global items.
P4: Why not, but maybe the 3 first actions should be placed after the other ones, since they would be less used. Same remark about the mixing of local and global items.
P5: A clear distinction between local and global scope. More used items are located first. This is my favorite one.
So +1 for P5, +0 for the other options so far.
Now, what about you?
Thanks, Guillaume
PS: I send this message to both devs and users mailing lists, because I think users are directly concerned by this topic.
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ users mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
participants (3)
-
Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) -
Guillaume Delhumeau -
Marius Dumitru Florea