[xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Deprecating SpaceDocs and Spaces panels
Hi devs, I’ve implemented http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12599 and as part of this issue I needed to handle the SpaceDocs Panel, and we also need to handle the Spaces panel. Here’s my proposal: * In general we should list only Panels that work for the Nested Pages (NP) mode in the Panel Wizard (i.e. not show any Panels containing the word “Space” in their title or content). The rationale is that the majority of uses of XWiki will be for NP. * We should continue to provide Panels that work for the Nested Spaces (NS) mode (e.g. SpaceDocs, Spaces), but as extensions on e.x.o and not bundled by default in XE * However we shouldn’t break existing XWiki instances and thus I’m proposing this: ** Deprecate the SpaceDocs and Spaces panels by displaying a message (when the user is Admin), trying to push the move to the newer Panels (Children, Siblings and Navigation panels). For example, this is what I’ve done for SpaceDocs: https://www.evernote.com/l/AHfvmKs-DSZBh4IJf1Wp7VV5JfK2pEmfgME Note that this allows Admins to see that message in the Panel Wizard too and thus not be tempted to use them. ** Keep the deprecated Panels for 1 full cycle (i.e. remove them in XWiki 9.0, i.e. move them to xwiki-contrib at that time). Basically a similar strategy than for young apis. WDYT? Thanks -Vincent
+1 Thanks, Marius On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 2:48 PM, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi devs,
I’ve implemented http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12599 and as part of this issue I needed to handle the SpaceDocs Panel, and we also need to handle the Spaces panel.
Here’s my proposal:
* In general we should list only Panels that work for the Nested Pages (NP) mode in the Panel Wizard (i.e. not show any Panels containing the word “Space” in their title or content). The rationale is that the majority of uses of XWiki will be for NP. * We should continue to provide Panels that work for the Nested Spaces (NS) mode (e.g. SpaceDocs, Spaces), but as extensions on e.x.o and not bundled by default in XE * However we shouldn’t break existing XWiki instances and thus I’m proposing this: ** Deprecate the SpaceDocs and Spaces panels by displaying a message (when the user is Admin), trying to push the move to the newer Panels (Children, Siblings and Navigation panels). For example, this is what I’ve done for SpaceDocs: https://www.evernote.com/l/AHfvmKs-DSZBh4IJf1Wp7VV5JfK2pEmfgME Note that this allows Admins to see that message in the Panel Wizard too and thus not be tempted to use them. ** Keep the deprecated Panels for 1 full cycle (i.e. remove them in XWiki 9.0, i.e. move them to xwiki-contrib at that time). Basically a similar strategy than for young apis.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
Please allow me to reiterate on the issues of using such terms ("siblings") in the UI. More specifically, the biggest problems you have are translations. For example, in the Romanian language, there is no specific translation for "sibling", and the word "frate" is used for both "sibling" and "brother". These terms are good to use internally, in technical situations held using the English language, but, by no means are adequate for UIs. It will inevitably cause dissent and concerns over gender discrimination (?) and, at least as far as I am concerned, we really don`t want to go down that road. The English term "child" also benefits from being gender neutral, and it is so probably (?) in many other languages, but, as detailed above, the same does not apply for "sibling". API & tree strucutres is one thing, UI is another. +1 for the deprecation -0 for the "Siblings" naming. Thanks, Eduard On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 4:41 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < [email protected]> wrote:
+1
Thanks, Marius
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 2:48 PM, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi devs,
I’ve implemented http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12599 and as part of this issue I needed to handle the SpaceDocs Panel, and we also need to handle the Spaces panel.
Here’s my proposal:
* In general we should list only Panels that work for the Nested Pages (NP) mode in the Panel Wizard (i.e. not show any Panels containing the word “Space” in their title or content). The rationale is that the majority of uses of XWiki will be for NP. * We should continue to provide Panels that work for the Nested Spaces (NS) mode (e.g. SpaceDocs, Spaces), but as extensions on e.x.o and not bundled by default in XE * However we shouldn’t break existing XWiki instances and thus I’m proposing this: ** Deprecate the SpaceDocs and Spaces panels by displaying a message (when the user is Admin), trying to push the move to the newer Panels (Children, Siblings and Navigation panels). For example, this is what I’ve done for SpaceDocs: https://www.evernote.com/l/AHfvmKs-DSZBh4IJf1Wp7VV5JfK2pEmfgME Note that this allows Admins to see that message in the Panel Wizard too and thus not be tempted to use them. ** Keep the deprecated Panels for 1 full cycle (i.e. remove them in XWiki 9.0, i.e. move them to xwiki-contrib at that time). Basically a similar strategy than for young apis.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
Hi Edy, On 20 Oct 2015 at 15:22:51, Eduard Moraru ([email protected](mailto:[email protected])) wrote:
Please allow me to reiterate on the issues of using such terms ("siblings") in the UI. More specifically, the biggest problems you have are translations.
For example, in the Romanian language, there is no specific translation for "sibling", and the word "frate" is used for both "sibling" and "brother". These terms are good to use internally, in technical situations held using the English language, but, by no means are adequate for UIs. It will inevitably cause dissent and concerns over gender discrimination (?) and, at least as far as I am concerned, we really don`t want to go down that road.
The English term "child" also benefits from being gender neutral, and it is so probably (?) in many other languages, but, as detailed above, the same does not apply for "sibling".
API & tree strucutres is one thing, UI is another.
I personally don’t see any problem with using “Child”, “Children” or “Siblings” in English. The fact that you have a problem to translate them in Romanian doesn’t negate the usefulness of having those panels… The Romanian translators can translate them the way that makes the most sense for their language (they can call them the equivalent of “Sub Pages” or “Pages in Parent” if that’s what makes sense in Romanian). But in English I don’t really see a problem for using those terms. Also note that I followed the existing names used in viewers (children and siblings) since it’s better to be consistent. You should make a VOTE with several proposals if you care about this. Thanks -Vincent
+1 for the deprecation
-0 for the "Siblings" naming.
Thanks, Eduard
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 4:41 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < [email protected]> wrote:
+1
Thanks, Marius
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 2:48 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Hi devs,
I’ve implemented http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12599 and as part of this issue I needed to handle the SpaceDocs Panel, and we also need to handle the Spaces panel.
Here’s my proposal:
* In general we should list only Panels that work for the Nested Pages (NP) mode in the Panel Wizard (i.e. not show any Panels containing the word “Space” in their title or content). The rationale is that the majority of uses of XWiki will be for NP. * We should continue to provide Panels that work for the Nested Spaces (NS) mode (e.g. SpaceDocs, Spaces), but as extensions on e.x.o and not bundled by default in XE * However we shouldn’t break existing XWiki instances and thus I’m proposing this: ** Deprecate the SpaceDocs and Spaces panels by displaying a message (when the user is Admin), trying to push the move to the newer Panels (Children, Siblings and Navigation panels). For example, this is what I’ve done for SpaceDocs: https://www.evernote.com/l/AHfvmKs-DSZBh4IJf1Wp7VV5JfK2pEmfgME Note that this allows Admins to see that message in the Panel Wizard too and thus not be tempted to use them. ** Keep the deprecated Panels for 1 full cycle (i.e. remove them in XWiki 9.0, i.e. move them to xwiki-contrib at that time). Basically a similar strategy than for young apis.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
On Tue, Oct 20, 2015 at 4:34 PM, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Edy,
On 20 Oct 2015 at 15:22:51, Eduard Moraru ([email protected](mailto: [email protected])) wrote:
Please allow me to reiterate on the issues of using such terms ("siblings") in the UI. More specifically, the biggest problems you have are translations.
For example, in the Romanian language, there is no specific translation for "sibling", and the word "frate" is used for both "sibling" and "brother". These terms are good to use internally, in technical situations held using the English language, but, by no means are adequate for UIs. It will inevitably cause dissent and concerns over gender discrimination (?) and, at least as far as I am concerned, we really don`t want to go down that road.
The English term "child" also benefits from being gender neutral, and it is so probably (?) in many other languages, but, as detailed above, the same does not apply for "sibling".
API & tree strucutres is one thing, UI is another.
I personally don’t see any problem with using “Child”, “Children” or “Siblings” in English. The fact that you have a problem to translate them in Romanian doesn’t negate the usefulness of having those panels
Please don`t confuse the functionality with the naming issue.
… The Romanian translators can translate them the way that makes the most sense for their language (they can call them the equivalent of “Sub Pages” or “Pages in Parent” if that’s what makes sense in Romanian). But in English I don’t really see a problem for using those terms.
Also note that I followed the existing names used in viewers (children and siblings
... which were actually the ones that started this whole issue, at least as far as I am concerned, so (again, from my POV) that only makes it worse :) ) since it’s better to be consistent.
You should make a VOTE with several proposals if you care about this.
Fair enough. Thanks, Eduard
Thanks -Vincent
+1 for the deprecation
-0 for the "Siblings" naming.
Thanks, Eduard
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 4:41 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < [email protected]> wrote:
+1
Thanks, Marius
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 2:48 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Hi devs,
I’ve implemented http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12599 and as part of this issue I needed to handle the SpaceDocs Panel, and we also need to handle the Spaces panel.
Here’s my proposal:
* In general we should list only Panels that work for the Nested Pages (NP) mode in the Panel Wizard (i.e. not show any Panels containing the word “Space” in their title or content). The rationale is that the majority of uses of XWiki will be for NP. * We should continue to provide Panels that work for the Nested Spaces (NS) mode (e.g. SpaceDocs, Spaces), but as extensions on e.x.o and not bundled by default in XE * However we shouldn’t break existing XWiki instances and thus I’m proposing this: ** Deprecate the SpaceDocs and Spaces panels by displaying a message (when the user is Admin), trying to push the move to the newer Panels (Children, Siblings and Navigation panels). For example, this is what I’ve done for SpaceDocs: https://www.evernote.com/l/AHfvmKs-DSZBh4IJf1Wp7VV5JfK2pEmfgME Note that this allows Admins to see that message in the Panel Wizard too and thus not be tempted to use them. ** Keep the deprecated Panels for 1 full cycle (i.e. remove them in XWiki 9.0, i.e. move them to xwiki-contrib at that time). Basically a similar strategy than for young apis.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
participants (3)
-
Eduard Moraru -
Marius Dumitru Florea -
vincent＠massol.net