On Jul 31, 2013, at 10:14 AM, Guillaume Louis-Marie Delhumeau <[email protected]> wrote:
I am not again to see the "wiki" term as the whole system and to call subwikis "workspaces" (if it is a better word), as long as we do not have both concepts of subwikis and workspaces.
Having both the following next to each other is really confusing: Add Space Add Workspace …. (hint: they both contain the word "space") Thanks -Vincent
Please send your votes ;)
Louis-Marie
2013/7/30 Guillaume "Louis-Marie" Delhumeau <[email protected]>
Hi everyone!
I vote for B.
I think we should completely *drop the notion of workspaces* and *only have the notion of "subwikis"*. During the creation wizard, we just add an option "use the global users only" that the user can enable or not (it should be enabled by default). So there is no type.
Then we drop the WikiManager and the WorkspaceManager UIs, and we create *a new unified one to manage all the subwikis*.
On the wiki index, we could show all the wikis where the user have the "view" right. All others wikis will be hidden for him (I think it is the use case of myxwiki.org).
In this way, everything is more simple and both the use case of current wiki farm and workspaces are supported.
Thanks,
Louis-Marie
2013/7/30 Vincent Massol <[email protected]>
On Jul 30, 2013, at 1:26 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Caty,
See below.
On Jul 30, 2013, at 1:10 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < [email protected]> wrote:
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 10:24 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:
On Jul 22, 2013, at 10:16 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <[email protected]>
wrote:
> On 07/20/2013 07:33 AM, Vincent Massol wrote: >> Hi devs, >> >> In the Roadmap proposal I've sent for XWiki 5.2 some days ago,
there's
this time: >> >> " >> * Have Workspace by default in XE + improved home page - Caty + Guillaume Delhumeau. FTR Guillaume is not a committer yet but he's going to work full time on XWiki development and especially on UI aspects from now on. Welcome aboard Guillaume, we need you! :) >> " >> >> Denis told me he didn't know about the proposal of having Workspaces integrated in the default XAR. Thus I'm sending this email to ensure we all agree about this. >> >> The rationale is: >> >> * It would be nice that when our users download XWiki (standalone version or install the default XAR) they get to see the power of XWiki. One of the very important differentiator of XWiki vs other wikis/solutions is our multi-tenancy feature and most of people downloading and installing XWiki don't see it. >> >> * XEM/Wiki Manager are lacking polishing because the committers mostly polish the default which doesn't include those. The UIs of XEM/Wiki Manager need polishing. Having them in default will ensure that we take them into account and make them first class citizens when we develop. >> >> Caty started working on the home page/UI improvements required to integrate this by default: >> http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/MultiWiki >> >> Here's my +1 >> > > This is a major shift in how first-time users perceive XWiki. Without > multi-wiki features, it still looks like a wiki, but if the homepage > changes from a "welcome to your wiki" page to a "here are your > workspaces" portal, then suddenly XWiki "becomes" something else in the > eyes of our users. I used quotes since nothing changes on the inside, > the multiwiki feature has been there since the beginning, and the single > wiki mode can still be used.
This isn't the plan as I mentioned in my previous emails. The plan is that the home page doesn't change. All that changes for a first time user installing XWiki is that the Add menu will have more entries (Add Workspace or Add Wiki or both, Caty is still working on the proposal).
Proposals:
* Changes to the Menu http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/HomeMenu
* "Add menu". I think you forgot to update the 3rd screenshots which the colibri skin, right?
* "Home Menu". For 5.2 I don't think we should have the following since we don't have any UI for them: ** Administration. I don't even know what it means at the global portal/system level ** All documents. Currently we don't have a LT that displays all docs from all wikis ** Applications Index. I don't see what you would do in this one. Listing all apps for all wikis for quick navigation? Not sure it's needed ** Note: Users index should list all global users * I don't like very much "Home" as the menu name since that represents a single wiki (the main wiki). We already have a menu entry to represent the current wiki. I'd prefer to have a "System" or "Portal" or "Farm" or …, i.e. something that represents the whole system and have only system-wide actions in it.
After more thoughts I think it's ok for a first version to have the new "Home" menu entry to represent the main wiki. However all subwikis menu entries should have the same entries except for "Wiki Index" which should only be in "Home".
In the future though, in the new model, we'll have a notion of System (farm of wikis) and maybe we'll implement it differently than in a wiki. But we can take care of this at that time… ;)
Right now the more important for me is to agree that we have only 1 concept: the notion of "Wiki" and to replace the notion of "Workspace" just by a checkbox in the wiki creation wizard: "Allow creating local users" (which is unchecked by default).
Note that we'll also need in 5.3+ a new right IMO: the right of creating a new wiki. For 5.2 we could just have a check in the wiki creation wizard page (for example on the user having Admin rights on the main wiki). If an Admin wants to change that to allow everyone to create a wiki he could edit that page and change the check.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
* "Wiki Menu". Should be the same as now + Users Index for listing all local users of the current wiki + Application Index for all apps of the current wiki, i.e. all actions that you can do on the current wiki
* Wiki/Workspace Creation
http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/CreateWikiImproveme...
(please chose between Option A, B or C)
Definitely +1 for B. I really think we need to drop the concept of workspaces and come back to the concept of wiki/subwiki. It's much simpler for the user. What we call "workspace" can be seen as a configuration for a wiki, i.e. the usage of global users only.
Thanks -Vincent
Thanks, Caty
> But this change in how XWiki is perceived has both advantages and > disadvantages. On one hand, it clearly shows users that XWiki is a > collaborative platform, not just a wiki, so people that need > collaboration more than just a wiki will be able to see that XWiki
isn't
> another boring wiki. On the other hand, people that are just looking for > a wiki that's nice to use and "not-ugly", might be put off by yet > another layer of complexity, and might drop XWiki from their list of > candidates. In other words, it alienates even more the kind of users > that already perceive XWiki as hard to use and overly complex. > > So, are we willing to trade one type of users for the other? It would be > in line with our vision of "enterprise collaboration", but I still think > we shouldn't voluntarily alienate any kind of users. > > An alternative is to wait for a real flavor, and then ask in the first > step of the distribution manager what kind of usage do we want. In the > meantime, we can still polish the pages that will go in the "workspaces" > flavor. > > So, -0 for switching to "workspaces only" in 5.2, unless we have really > good backwards compatibility and a flavor for a simple wiki for textual > collaboration.
I hope the above allays your fears :)
Thanks -Vincent
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