12 Mar
2012
12 Mar
'12
10:30 a.m.
On Fri, Mar 9, 2012 at 11:51 PM, Denis Gervalle <dgl(a)softec.lu> wrote:
Le 9 mars 2012 16:59, "Vincent Massol"
<vincent(a)massol.net> a écrit :
The history is not lost. If you do a join (all active repos) you still have it.
I do not know what you means by joining all repos, but I would be surprise
to see the IDE find its way between them. I even wonder how it could be
possible.
doesn't
do that and I don't know how to do it?
If I had to implement it, I will probably use some hashing method to be
able to recognize similar commits, since there effectively no link between
them. But my main remarks that the statistics are broken, not the way we
use git.
right. You have to remember the full history and it's just too hard.
I would be really disappointed to have to conclude that. There is probably
some edge cases, but most of the time there is clever work around. You have
to talk to Sergiu :-)
I sent this mail because there is no current pratice, don't mix what
you do with a de facto rule.
On Mar 2, 2012, at 10:06 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 29, 2012 at 08:19, Vincent Massol <vincent(a)massol.net>
wrote:
Hi,
On Feb 28, 2012, at 12:17 PM, Thomas Mortagne wrote:
> Hi devs,
>
> Since I plan to move some stuff from platform to commons I would like
> to know what you think of the history in this case.
>
> Pros including history:
> * can access easily the whole history of a moved file.
This is really an important matter, especially for those joining the
project. When you follow XWiki from "outside", and not in a continuous
manner, the history is of great value to understand why stuffs are like
they are, and what you may do, or not when moving forward.
>> But sometimes
>>> changing packages etc make too much difference for git to see it's
>>> actually the same file so you loose it anyway.
>>
>
> If you simply change the package name, and nothing else, it is really
> unlikely to happen.
>
>
>>>
>>> Cons including history:
>>> * double the history which make tools like ohloh indicate wrong
>> informations
>>
>
> Sure, the stats will be broken, but what is the matter. This is not
> cheating, just a misfeature in Ohloh, since the commit are just
identical,
> something they may notice. IMO, this is the
matter of the statistical
tools
to
improve that.
Can you tell me how to implement this because right now my GitHub tool
>>> * it's a lot easier to move without history
>>
>
> There should be some tools to improve that point or we may write one,
once
for all.
So this is not a real cons either.
It's really hard to copy history in Git. It's almost impossible to do it
>>> WDYT ?
>>>
>>> Even if it was looking a bit weird to me at first I'm actually +1 to
>>> not move the history in this case.
>>
>> +1, FTR I'd be -0, close to -1 to move it. If/when the source
repository
> >> is removed for one reason or another, then we might want to import its
> >> history somewhere.
> >>
> >
> > Seems we are really opposite on this one, since I am close to -1 to not
> > move it.
>
> Sorry but that's the current practice :) It's also the easiest one.
Until we have Git, there were no better way. This does not means that we
should not improve our practice. By the way, it was not my thread, if
Thomas has asked, it means that the current practice was not so current.
of
tools since the history is not lost. It's still there in our active
repos.
There is absolutely no link between these histories. It is not only a
question of tools. Moreover, requiring querying all active repositories to
have a proper history completely defeat the purpose of having separate
repositories.
I do not see the comparison with my remark above. Git has been made for
versionning, not for statistics, it is not my fault.
you'd be so much in favor if you had tried it. I suggest you try it a few
times on your own projects first :) It's really hard to do it right and
very time consuming.
When I have copied the security component from contrib, I have done so. I
hope that I am not alone. And, frankly, it was not so hard, compare to the
advantage you have.
repo
is removed then its history is copied I agree about that.
I would like to know how you do that after the facts?
A huge majority of xwiki's history is already lost to IDEs (when we moved from
SVN) even though the SVN history was moved. Even Git itself doesn't
follow the history when you move stuff around. Said differently it's alwasy
possible to find the history but the IDE and "standard" tool don't follow
it.
It does so far better since we move to Git and it is really a valuable
tool. Do you means that because in a few case, the history may be broken,
that we should not try to have it as complete as possible?
In Git, nothing is fully permanent, that is all I say.
The hard part if that git does not help much in isolating the history
of some complex modules when this module path changed a lot or was
created by extracting classes from another module for example so you
have to know what happen. But even in thoses case you can at worst
still go through all the files one by one and check what was all its
past paths to match them properly even if it's a pain. Most of the
time it's not that hard, for example matching he whole EM history is
about matching *-extension/, it's very slow because there is a lot of
revisions in platform but at least it's working well.
I don't have much to say against Denis's arguments, as I said in my
very first mail it was mostly lazyness so if someone feel it does
worth the effort then ok. I don't see statistics tools as a really
strong argument against keeping the history where the current source
is either, was just a nice to have. And as Denis suggested, may they
actually already filter duplicate history or will do in the future.
> Statistics is really less valuable IMO, it is a small interest compare
to
code
history, that I have use a lot, especially when I have join the
project and follow sparingly.
I can say exactly the same thing as you said above. It's just a question
> So the general rule for me is: Copy history when the source repository
is
>
removed/deleted/not used anymore.
How many times have you done this? I believe 0 times since I don't think You never know what will happen to a repository
in the future, so this
rules is somewhat a hope on the future, no more. And remembering that we
may loose history if we do some change in the old repository, is for me
like hoping you will remember my birthday ;)
I don't agree with this at all. Again we're not loosing history. If a >
Eduard was proposing to include in the first commit of the new
> repository the id of the last commit containing the files (basically
> the id of the parent of the commit deleting the files) in the old
> repository so that it's easier to find it. I'm +1 for this.
But you loose all the benefits of the IDE tools that brings history of a
selection automatically and that are really useful.
> Moreover, if the history is rewritten due to a change in structure
later,
the hash
may be broken.
Not sure I understand this one.
You should really measure the cost of what you propose Denis. It's really
hard
to do.
Prove me that is more cost than the one newcommers has to enter the
project. Maybe you do not value history so much because you have by your
own experience of the project a good knowledge of what happen in the past.
When I dig in some code, I always found history valuable to understand why
that piece of code is not written the way I may have expected and why I
should not got that way.
If Thomas conclude it is too hard to be done, and not just some developer's
lazyness, I would understand; but I do not agree that it should not be done
just because it breaks statistics or we think it is too hard. This is why I
suggest a tools that do it once for all. I would be really disappointed of
Git if we had to conclude this.
Thanks,
Denis
--
Thomas Mortagne
Thanks
-Vincent
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http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs So having a broken history is hardening the task
of those who want to
participate. A great value compare to the statistics IMO.
--
Denis Gervalle
SOFTEC sa - CEO
eGuilde sarl - CTO
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