21 Oct
2014
21 Oct
'14
11:38 a.m.
Hello Edi,
On Mon, Oct 20, 2014 at 12:34 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 7:26 PM, Anca Luca
<lucaa(a)xwiki.com> wrote:
I need to think a little more about this in order to make a complete
answer, but I read the list of usecases and I remarked one thing:
In all UC1 to UC5, I think your "user" is more of an "admin" than a
user. I
see the following flow in working with a wiki:
Alice downloads the wiki and plays around with it locally, tests it and
checks its features. Then, she is convinced by the tool and decides to move
this to the next level and install the wiki on a server (or get it
installed) so that she can collaborate with her colleagues, Bob, Billy and
Bogdan. To me Alice is not a user, she's more like a wiki admin. Then when
the wiki is installed on the server, the three B boys are the users and
Alice might become a user as well, or might always stay a little more
admin. When she moves from her private tests to a public tool, Alice
prepares the homepage of the wiki so that it matches the purpose of the
wiki and the B boys. Alice will need to "UC3: The user needs to be able to
easily replace the home page with his content" but the B boys won't.
I think that the admin (Alice) homepage needs cannot be analysed
independently from the user (Bob, Billy and Bogdan) homepage needs, because
we risk to provide the admin with customization tools that they will never
need because the user will never need such a customization.
Thanks,
Anca
Hello all,
so on the topic of "removing the dashboard from the homepage" and if
people
need it they can access it independently.
In my opinion, this dashboard does not really exist or have any value
beyond the homepage. I mean, what does it mean, what is it used for
besides
the homepage? What would the dashboard be used
other than having an
overview of the wiki? And if people remove it from the homepage of the
wiki, what would they put instead? An overview of the wiki? Isn't that
what
dashboard means?
The idea of this proposal was that the homepage should be customized by the
admin. It should be a homepage. Instead of a Dashboard, it should contain
information about the purpose of the wiki, information for newcomers,
information about the organization, some video, etc. All of this we plan to
encourage the admins to customize so that they "take ownership" of their
wiki instead of seeing it as just a tool with default settings. Some may
see disadvantages to this, and prefer default tools, but others may see the
value of getting the user/admin involved.
The Dashboard should be seen as a place to go to in order to see what is
going on. Dashboards in the wild also tend to be customizable per users (we
technically support that as well, but it could be improved, i.e. have a
default user dashboard in the 'My dashboard' section in the user profile
instead of the empty space that is right now in view mode, promote it more,
etc.). They also tend to be used by more technical people
Once the admin is involved and now aware of how to do things, he can easily
include the dashboard on the homepage if that is his view on the purpose of
his wiki. We can even propose it in the default content of the homepage.
What you choose depends a lot on the usecase you have for your wiki, i.e.
what flavor you`re using. For example, a dashboard is good for
intranet/groupware but not that good for public websites. We are
considering here what we want the default experience to offer/encourage and
maybe we should not really focus on/be influenced by any of the flavors/use
cases we are having in mind.
By this logic, I would find it strange to have a homepage and a
dashboard,
as 2 separate entities, because for me they would
mean the same thing. So
multiple possibilities:
1/ our _default_ dashboard displayed on the homepage (included or not, I
don't care) is not good enough because it does not offer a good _default_
overview of the wiki. We need to change the dashboard.
This is not part of the use cases [1] extracted from previous discussions.
Are you proposing that we add "offer a good overview of the wiki" as a new
use case/goal or is this just a rewording of UC5 (navigation) ?
Thanks,
Eduard
[1] http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/HomepageUseCases
take
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In this case, we
improve the way we modify this dashboard, to allow people to change the
"default" overview which guides the user through the wiki with an
overview
that is more adapted to the user's usecase.
2/ we change the homepage and we remove the dashboard from it and
implement
an overview of the wiki differently (which would
still be a dashboard at
the conceptual level but implemented differently). In this case, the
Dashboard.WebHome should be removed completely from the menu, because the
dashboard _is_ the home page (see my remark above) :) . We can make the
homepage a regular page so that users can edit it very easily by default,
but we also allow them to easily make it a dashboard with gadgets and
drag
& drop, so that they can organize their
content. I am thinking for
example
of a button on the homepage, in view mode
injected with javascript or UI
extension or I don't know, which runs a script that creates a new version
of the homepage which contains a dashboard macro call and a default
gadget
and the user is taken to the edit mode of the
homepage, with the
dashboard
editor in it.
The only reason why the dashboard is separate now, in Dashboard.WebHome,
is
for legacy reasons, because it used to be
included as the homepage of all
sort of default spaces, so we needed something that can be re-used for
spaces homes as well. Otherwise, from my point of view, it does not need
to
be a separate entity. I mean, one should be able
to create as many
dashboards as they'd want (on any page they want), but by default the
dashboard of the wiki is only one, the homepage of the wiki.
Anca
On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 3:23 PM, vincent(a)massol.net <vincent(a)massol.net>
wrote:
> Hi devs,
>
> As you know I started working on a Home Page Application, see:
> - JIRA with screenshots: http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-10586
> - Discussion thread: http://markmail.org/message/ghelufamwucog46x
>
> I have it all done locally but I refrained from committing it because
on
> the email thread some expressed their
doubts.
>
> I started thinking about it and I expressed some idea in the thread
> started by Caty about "Wiki - Space - Page concepts pitch":
> http://markmail.org/message/jefze7nvprz36pkw
>
> I’m pasting it here again for discussion (with some edits):
>
> "
> BTW concerning the home page, I’m more and more leaning towards
removing
the
dashboard from it (it’s accessible from the App panel anyway) and
instead have it contain:
- explanation about how the wiki is organized (wikis, spaces, pages)
- explanation about base concepts (editing, saving, etc)
- encourage the user to edit this home page to make it his own and put
the
> content he wishes instead
>
> I think this would solve the following issues:
> - users always want to customize the home page and this makes it easy
> (it’s a standard page, no dashboard). This is also a way for them to > ownership of the wiki as theirs.
> - explains the main concepts of wiki, space, page
>
> Of course, we also need to provide a navigation panel for easy
navigation
> in the wiki/spaces/pages.
> “
>
> If we agree about the idea of removing the dashboard and instead have a
> simple page then we’ll need to discuss the exact content and for that
I’m
> proposing to discuss with Caty/GuillaumeD
and make a proposal for
further
> discussion. Of course any idea in reply to
this email would also be
much
> appreciated.
>
> But first things first! We first need to decide if this is a good idea
or
not.
WDYT?
Thanks
-Vincent
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