7 May
2010
7 May
'10
8:57 p.m.
Ludovic Dubost wrote:
Hi,
A few comments in the invitation manager discussion.
First, caty's proposal looks very nice and well integrated with the
XWiki UI.
It seems it's indeed missing the "send to mailing list" feature which
exists in the current invitation manager. This is a very cool feature
which is needed. It basically means that the invitation is not deleted
after being used once.
This is easy enough to implement.
There are a few other features that are available in the current
invitation manager which I believe are also important. I'm not sure if
they are or not supported with Caleb's work:
1/ Support of joining a specific space after the invitation:
This meant a lot in XWiki Workspace, but can also mean something in
XWiki. It basically means getting the rights to a space or automatically
joining a group after accepting the invitation. I think the best way is
to implement it as joining a group.
I have been planning a second document to
handle the registration of the user.
Separated because it might need to have PR if registration is closed on the wiki
and thus should be as short as possible to minimize security risk.
2/ Support for invitation to non registered users as well as registered
users:
In the case of 1/, we invite by email, without know if the user is
member or not. If he is already then he can just use the invitation code
to join the group.
Invitation of registered users to join a group is a use case I
had not foreseen
I don't think it would be hard if the invitation is still sent by mail.
3/ Support for join requests:
A user wants to join a wiki or a space/group. He can ask for it and the
admin can accept/refuse him. This is part of the current invitation
manager.
This looks tricky because groups don't really have administrators so
it's hard to
know who should handle the invitation request. It could be set up so that anyone with
write access on the group object is shown requests. Maybe this could be implemented
later after the primary code is running.
4/ Internationalization
We need to make sure the invitation email templates can be
internationalized
The templates were made configurable with the idea that admins
would change them
it is not too difficult to make a translation key for the templates but it will make
them less readable when modifying them.
5/ Compatibility with the current invitation manager storage:
We need to be as compatible as possible with how the current invitation
manager stores it's configuration and state (current invitation and
requests).
I haven't taken this approach so far and changing now will take
some work and there
will be some parameters which are not used. I'm not sure what the use case is, is it
so that users of the invitation manager can upgrade seamlessly? I had not foreseen
that use case.
I'm not sure how things have been currently coded
in Caleb's
work.
The invitation manager (plugin) is closely connected to the space manager
plugin neither of which are currently included in Enterprise by default.
Since the concept of space membership seems no longer used, I opted to write
invitation over and have been working on it as a velocity application because
all of the functionality is within the script API and applications can run
without PR making them much less of a security risk, also because invitation
seems to me as something which belongs on the application side with blog and
administration rather than in the core with rendering and cache.
I understand the current invitation manager is a
plugin and a
component would be better, but I hope we are not fully reinventing the
wheel here.
Unfortunately I think reinventing the wheel is needed because as a
plugin
the invitation manager is dependent on the core which is not allowed for
components, also since I have been writing it as an application it has to
be rewritten anyway.
The invitation manager has been coded in Curriki (and
not in
XWiki Workspace as Vincent previously said) and it has received a lot of
feedback and requirements from the Curriki Project Team. It's a well
thought module from the UI perspective. You can go see it in action on
http://www.curriki.org
I approached this project with the philosophy that it should only include
basic functionality which will be used on a large percentage of installations.
My thinking was that users who needed the most functionality or current users
of the invitation manager plugin would be the big installations (like curriki)
who have the time to integrate the invitation manager plugin into new versions
or even to write their own custom code.
I propose going ahead with a simple piece for inviting non members to a wiki.
Then adding /1 and /2 which shouldn't be difficult then we can look into adding
/3 with input from the community who will by now have had some time to test the
invitation application. /4 is relatively easy using $msg.get and can be implemented
early. I'm not sure what the end goal is for /5 so I will need some more information
but my immediate thought is I don't like it because it will mean storage and
configuration would fit code which is no longer used and would be less of a fit for
the code they are working with.
WDYT?
Caleb
I'm sure once it's out and being used we will hear great ideas for additional
functionality which nobody had thought of.
Ludovic
Le 22/04/10 17:31, Ecaterina Valica a écrit :
Proposal at
http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/InvitationProposal
Thanks,
Caty
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 16:49, Caleb James
DeLisle<calebdelisle(a)lavabit.com
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Yes. This all sounds great and easy to do using
the template (I think)
Haven't investigated the CSS end but I imagine<style>blah</style> is
what they're talking about which can easily be integrated in the
template.
Caleb
Ecaterina Valica wrote:
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Also I want to know if we are gonna integrate
some CSS in the email
content
or is gonna be just simple text?
Reference: Guide to CSS support in email clients
http://www.campaignmonitor.com/css/
Caty
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 16:12, Ecaterina Valica<valicac(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> "*evalica has invited you to join incubator.myxwiki.org*" this should
>
be
> replaced with First Name and Last Name,
instead of account name. These
> messages tend to be personal and the receiver should recognize the
>
person
> without knowing it's nickname.
>
> In my vision this is a feature that could be used by everyone and not
>
just
> admins.
>
> Caty
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 15:17, Marius Dumitru Florea<
> mariusdumitru.florea(a)xwiki.com> wrote:
>
>
>> See below,
>>
>> Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
>>
>>> Ecaterina Valica wrote:
>>>
>>>> Also, when you hit the Preview, you actually see that Subject and
>>>>
>> Message
>>
>>>> fields have standard content. This content should be displayed from
>>>>
the
>>>> start and the user should have
control over it.
>>>>
>>> I was thinking the mail should give some explanation of why the
>>> email
>>>
>> was sent, suppose the
>>
>>> user clears the default content and sets "buy cheap
>>>
>> pharmaceuticals....." as the entire content.
>>
>>> The mail recipient will have no way of knowing how the mail got to
>>>
them
>> or reporting it as spam.
>>
>>> Anyway the default template is adjustable in the admin app so it's
>>>
just
>> a matter of what it is by
>>
>>> default.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Most of the users will leave
>>>> the standard configurations alone.
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 11:15, Ecaterina Valica<valicac(a)gmail.com>
>>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 08:51, Marius Dumitru Florea<
>>>>> mariusdumitru.florea(a)xwiki.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Caleb,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Another matter is what should it be named, I have been
>>>>>>> calling it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> "friendInviter" which is an awkward name
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> but invitation manager is a name which will lead to
confusion
>>>>>>>
since
>> it
>>
>>>>>> does not use the invitation manager
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> plugin.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> xwiki-invitation sounds good to me too, as Vincent suggested.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vincent Massol wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Apr 20, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I have a working prototype of the invitation mail
sender and I
>>>>>>>>>
>> would
>>
>>>>>> like to put it in the sandbox.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I need to know how that should be done and should
this be a
>>>>>>>>>
>> separate
>>
>>>>>> top level project on jira?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Some guidance here would be great.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> +1 for a top level app in platform/applications (which
means a
>>>>>>>>
jira
>> for
>>
>>>>>> it too).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As for the process, I'm proposing:
>>>>>>>> 1) explain what this app would do (maybe you already
did?)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I described what I hoped to achieve here:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
http://www.pubbs.net/201001/xwiki/60333-xwiki-devs-proposal-allow-users-to-…
>>>>>>> and show a mockup
of its UI so that we can agree about it
>>>>>>> and get
>>>>>>>
>> help
>>
>>>>>> for our community designers
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There has been one here for a while, I rewrote the code but
>>>>>>> the UI
>>>>>>>
>> is
>>
>>>>>> the same.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
http://incubator.myxwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/InvitationMail/FriendInviter
>>>>>> I couldn't find a
mockup for displaying the list of invitations
>>>>>> (pending/accepted) sent by the user.
>>>>>>
>>> Something I hadn't thought of, shouldn't be very hard to implement.
>>>
>>>
>>>>> After all people accepted, do we still keep the list of invited
>>>>>
>> people? Is
>>
>>>>> this a token of user's popularity? :P Just like Gmail, you could
>>>>>
have
>> a
>>
>>>>> limited number of people you could invite in the wiki and take
>>>>> care
>>>>>
of
>> your
>>
>>>>> followers :) we shouldn't do that, but was just an idea.
>>>>>
>>> There is nothing that advanced at the moment but it can be
>>> discussed.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> I think this should appear
>>>>>> somewhere on the user profile.
>>>>>>
>>> What exactly would it say in the profile. I'm somewhat resistant to
>>>
the
>> idea because it can't currently
>>
>>> be done with modularity.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> Also, is it possible to cancel an
>>>>>> invitation?
>>>>>>
>>> Somehow stop the email en route? Send another one saying "just
>>>
kidding"?
>>> When the user comes to sign up say:
"Nobody really likes you we were
>>>
>> just kidding."
>>
>>> Anyway the join button currently only redirects to the registration
>>>
page
>> and does
>>
>>> nothing special.
>>>
>> In the case where registration is allowed only for invited people,
>> you'll want for sure to cancel an invitation sent to a wrong email
>> address. By cancel I mean just marking somehow the invitation
>> object as
>> "invalid". Sending a "sorry for the noise" mail is nut such a
bad
>> idea.
>>
>>
>>>>>> I have two use cases in mind:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * the user sends the invitation to the wrong email address
>>>>>> * the user wants to delete invitations that haven't been
accepted
>>>>>>
in
>> a
>>
>>>>>> specific amount of time (e.g. the invitee is asked to register
>>>>>>
before
>> a
>>
>>>>>> given date)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> If this step would be for the administrator, would be nice from
>>>>> the
>>>>>
>> list of
>>
>>>>> accepted users, that we can apply batch operations for giving
>>>>> rights
>>>>>
>> and
>>
>>>>> adding people in certain groups. Again, just an idea.
>>>>>
>>> Have to change the nature of the registration process + no UI
>>>
extensions
>> = no modularity.
>>
>>> It could be done though.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> How is the invitation application going to work in a wiki where
>>>>>> registration is disabled? i.e. you have to be invited to be
>>>>>> able to
>>>>>> register.
>>>>>>
>>> Another use case I didn't think of. Might require API changes if
>>>
>> registration is blocked
>>
>>> by setting register permission to deny. Also will cause some kind of
>>>
>> dependency. I try
>>
>>> to resist dependencies lest every page depend on every other page
>>> and
>>>
>> removal of one causes
>>
>>> total destruction of the system. Still this sounds like a compelling
>>>
use
>> case. Maybe this
>>
>>> should be implemented now or road mapped for later? Any thoughts?
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> Regarding the send invitation form, I think it would be useful
to
>>>>>>
add
>>>>>> explanatory text below
each label. For instance, it's not clear
>>>>>>
that
>> the
>>
>>>>>> user has to enter an email address in the "Who you are
inviting:"
>>>>>>
>> field
>>
>>>>>> (can I enter multiple email addresses?).
>>>>>>
>>> Only if you can edit the page (admin) but I see your point.
>>> Should the
>>>
>> explaination be in line
>>
>>> or in a separate help page?
>>>
>> In line is best, IMO.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Marius
>>
>>
>>>>>> Also on the same page we should
>>>>>> describe what happens with the invitation (the fact than an
email
>>>>>>
is
>>>>>> sent to the specified
email address) and ask the user to not
>>>>>> abuse
>>>>>>
>> this
>>
>>>>>> feature because his right to send invitations can be removed
>>>>>> if his
>>>>>> invitations are reported as spam.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> I don't understand why you have 2 interfaces that do the same
>>>>>
thing.
>>> Those who have edit get special
privileges (send to multiple
>>>
addresses,
>> configure the
>>
>>> application etc.)
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Why
>>>>> there is a version if you have edit right for the page? If you
>>>>> don't
>>>>>
>> have
>>
>>>>> edit rights you shouldn't see a form, but just the labels and
>>>>>
content
>> of the
>>
>>>>> form elements, or nothing at all.
>>>>>
>>> It is targeted toward those who don't have edit on the page.
>>> Otherwise
>>>
>> why would we
>>
>>> try to thwart spam when the user can simply edit the code and remove
>>>
our
>> measures.
>>
>>>>> The first problem I see in the usability is, like Marius said,
>>>>>
>> inviting
>>
>>>>> multiple people in the same step. This step is essentially for the
>>>>> productivity and is working different in the view/pretendEdit
>>>>> right
>>>>>
>> mode.
>>
>>> It should not be working unless the user has edit.
>>>
>>>
>>>>> In the pretendEdit mode you have a textarea for entering lists of
>>>>>
>> emails
>>
>>>>> with separators. The view mode has validation for the email field.
>>>>>
Do
>> you
>>
>>>>> plan to validate the multiple mails too?
>>>>>
>>> There is server side validation, LiveValidation would need a
>>> separate
>>>
>> regular expression
>>
>>> for multiple email addresses, it's an easy change to make but will
>>>
lead
>> to plenty of trouble
>>
>>> if the admins waht to change the email validation regular
>>> expression.
>>>
>> barring that I would have
>>
>>> to change LiveValidation which is a third party library.
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Also users are not very good at
>>>>> following directions like "*with a comma and a space*".
>>>>>
>>> Yes, that's something I have changed (now it's just a space since it
>>>
>> seems more intuitive)
>>
>>>>> A solution for this would be just like the way we add Tags.
>>>>> Provide
>>>>>
an
>>>>> overlay for entering emails
one by one. This way you can validate
>>>>>
them
>> in
>>
>>>>> the overlay and also take care of the separators. The emails could
>>>>>
be
>>>>> deleted using the corner X.
>>>>>
>>> I imagined the main use case was for admins (those with edit)
>>>
>> copy-pasting lists of addresses
>>
>>> into the page keep in mind, non admins are unable to use this
>>> feature
>>>
>> and I'd like to put most
>>
>>> of the time into features which will be used often. Maybe we could
>>>
wait
>> and implement this type
>>
>>> of thing later on if there is desire. How important do you think
>>> it is
>>>
>> to have this now?
>>
>>>>> The problem with this solution is if the user is experimented
>>>>> and he
>>>>>
>> has a
>>
>>>>> standard list of emails he wants to paste, without entering one by
>>>>>
>> one. We
>>
>>>>> should satisfy both use cases.
>>>>>
>>> Thank you for the responses, it's always hard for me writing the
>>> code
>>>
to
>> see all of the use cases.
>>
>>> Caleb
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Caty
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hope this helps,
>>>>>> Marius
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2) send a vote mail to include the invitation manager in
XE by
>>>>>>>>
>> default
>>
>>>>>> (if not already done)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'd like to have something concrete in the sandbox to
vote on.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 3) code it, you could start in the sandbox indeed or
>>>>>>>> directly in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform/applications if 1) and 2) have been agreed on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I will commit to the sandbox later today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> -Vincent
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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