5 Nov
2012
5 Nov
'12
2:07 p.m.
Hello,
My opinion of github is not very bright, there's vender lockin because you can't
easily migrate
issues and other value addeds and they don't open source their platform so while git
allows you
to push somewhere else, you can't have the nice web interface with the features
without going through
them.
That said, it is hard to argue with 3 clicks and a `git push`.
While it would be easy to dismiss me as "lazy", I see this dismissal as a huge
problem for the free
software movement in general. Why should an ordinary person ask for permission to use
xwiki-contrib
then make sure their pom.xml parent ID is in order when they could just do 3 clicks and a
git push?
Granted XWiki is far better off than some projects, when I see copyright release forms and
patent
non-infringement statements which have to be signed, I find it mindboggling that anyone
would contribute
to these projects at all given all of the roadblocks which have been erected.
A good example of a social good also being more useful is Linux. I love Linux, it is free
software and
it is fast, even the giants such as Microsoft and Apple can't afford to outspend the
army of companies
who pour money into profiling, tweaking, optimizing, and refactoring Linux and the result
is a network
stack which blows the doors off of everyone else in the market. And it got that way being
free.
Now the question of how we should make xwiki-contrib more attractive than $THE_OTHER_GUY
is worth asking.
It is better for the contributor, they get continuous integration and issue tracking, but
none of it is
automated. Since we're all pretty busy and automating this process is probably not on
anybody's roadmap,
I think we're going to have to accept that it's easier to start off a small
project in one's own namespace
and then move when it grows and the contributor wants to take advantage of the services in
xwiki-contrib.
If we don't at least understand this fundamental issue then the githubs and facebooks
of the world with
their 1 click walled gardens will win.
Thanks,
Caleb
On 11/05/2012 04:02 AM, Jerome Velociter wrote:
On 10/23/2012 09:33 AM, Vincent Massol wrote:
On Oct 23, 2012, at 9:20 AM, Ludovic Dubost
<ludovic(a)xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi Vincent,
This is a interesting topic and there are several aspects to it.
For me the "discoverability" argument for having projects on
https://github.com/xwiki-contribdoes not make much sense. The centralized place for
projects around XWiki is http://extensions.xwiki.org, not github. There's the
"view source" button that tells where the sources are. Github is a convenience
here, and it's always possible to "copy" (or fork) a project in
xwiki-contrib, for whatever reason (original project not active, etc.).
That being said I understand why you think it's better to have as much projects as
possible under the xwiki-contrib umbrella : it makes it a one-stop shop with the same
tools, same workflow, same permissions, etc.
Here are the arguments I see for why one contributor or contributing organization would
want to host its projects itself :
- use of own tools and own workflow (github issues vs. JIRA for example).
- it allows a contributor or contributing organization to have it's own place to
centralize its contribution(s) (the "beef up" argument as you say). I think this
can make sense in some circonstances, especially for contributing organizations (companies
for example).
The bottom line comes down to : what rules do we want for using the
"org.xwiki.contrib" groupId and tools (maven repos, CI, etc.) ?
If we want a rule saying that the project should be hosted on github.com/xwiki-contrib/
then that's that, and I think it's fair. We just have to decide on it (right now
there is no such rule according to http://contrib.xwiki.org/).
Jerome
This should have been for devs Envoyé de mon
iPhone Début du message transféré :
> Expéditeur: Ludovic Dubost <ludovic(a)xwiki.com> Date: 23 octobre 2012 09:19:55
UTC+02:00 Destinataire: XWiki Users <users(a)xwiki.org> Objet: Github tracker. was:
Re: [xwiki-users] New Realtime collaborative editing extension. Just a quick. You seem to
introduce a practice to use the github tracker instead of xwiki.org jira's Not sure
it's a good thing. I'm sure Vincent will agree
Well, what I would prefer
personally is that contrib projects be in the xwiki-contrib organization and use the XWiki
tools (wiki, jira, etc). The reason is that this allows: * to group together projects
around XWiki (they're not scattered everywhere on the web and harder to find) * make
it a neutral location for people to collaborate together on xwiki projects. That's a
key element to contribution IMO * is more long term. If you stop working on the project
it's not going to be a dead project
in someone's github repo and it'll have more chance of being maintained/seen in
the xwiki-contrib repo I know Jerome also puts his contributions in his own github project
and I had the same reservation about it. We can't force anyone of course since this is
a contribution but it's more collaborative to make them xwiki-contrib project,
following the rules defined at http://contrib.xwiki.org I understand you may want to beef
up your github profile but for collaboration I feel the xwiki-contrib
is better with the 2 arguments listed above. Jerome, Caleb let me know what you think.
Thanks -Vincent
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http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > Ludovic Envoyé de mon iPhone Le 23 oct. 2012
à 04:17, Caleb James DeLisle <calebdelisle(a)lavabit.com> a écrit :
>> One other thing, please report the features which you want and what you imagine
as best on the github tracker, it's easier to close an issue as "won't
fix" than it is to remember an important issue which nobody wrote down ;) Thanks
Caleb On 10/22/2012 10:14 PM, Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
>>> Hi, Thanks for the complement. I just updated it and fixed issue #1. Thanks
for reporting it. Somehow showing who else is editing, showing where they are editing in
the document and allowing the user to spawn a chat window with other editors on the page
are all interesting possibilities. Right now I think the thing to do is decide where there
is the most bang for your buck in terms of feature value and get an idea of what's
most natural for the user. Thanks, Caleb On 10/19/2012 07:59 AM,
>>> Ryszard Łach wrote:
>>>> Great work! It looks like good starting point to give xwiki the main (at
least for me) feature, that makes googledoc sometimes more suitable for collaborative
editing. It would be really great, if your editor would show somehow, where the other
editor (person) is now, where is his cursor. Maybe a highlight (the whole line) showing
the other's cursor placement? Do you plan to work on such improvements? R.
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