27 Nov
2015
27 Nov
'15
4:53 p.m.
On 27 Nov 2015 at 16:42:39, Guillaume Lerouge
(guillaume@xwiki.com(mailto:guillaume@xwiki.com)) wrote:
Hi,
Right now users can already create sibling pages when they click the Add button on a
page.
It would be easy to add a small warning when you’re on a terminal page and you click Add
to mention that this is a terminal page that cannot have children.
Hi Marius,
really
2 reasons:
*1/ Practical reason:* as a simple user, if I go to a terminal page and
create a page from there, I will create a sibling to the current page
instead of a child to the current page. I will not know why it happened
like this, nor will I have the ability to change it.
On Fri, Nov 27, 2015 at 12:40 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea <
mariusdumitru.florea(a)xwiki.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2015 at 4:55 PM, Guillaume Lerouge
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Devs,
> >
> > after trying XE 7.4 snapshot some more, I kept asking myself what
was
the
> > point of even allowing terminal pages
to exists. I couldn't see a
good
> > reason why any given page would *need*
to be terminal, whereas it
poses
> > some issues:
> >
> > - There is no visual distinction between terminal pages and nested
> pages
> > in the interface (besides "WebHome" in the URL, which would be
cleaner
> to
> remove)
> - We're planning to make it possible to reference a nested page in
wiki
> syntax without having to write "WebHome" in it
> - When creating a new page from a terminal page, you're creating a
> sibling instead of a child page, which breaks the user expectation
(and
> the
> breadcrumb)
>
> - For AWM applications, data/content pages are created as terminal
> pages, which makes it impossible to add further content underneath
them
> in
> the future (say, sub-tasks that would go as child pages of tasks)
> - To my knowledge, there is no easy way to transform a terminal page
> into a nested page should the need arise later on
>
See http://lists.xwiki.org/pipermail/users/2015-November/031558.html
Thanks. I understand it's fine to have terminal pages, but are they *needed*?
My feeling is that keeping this concept generates complexity for no
obvious
benefit.
What really generates complexity ATM is the difference between the UI
(Nested Pages) and the Model (Nested Spaces). I’d like to start a design to
explore what options we have to remove the concept of Spaces in the model
and only have pages. I have the feeling it’s going to be tough to not break
everything but need to explore it to know our options.
I feel that terminal pages are already well hidden in the UI so I’m not
sure why you think we should remove it completely from the UI. Why do you
fear that it’s too advanced for advanced users?
*2/ Philosophical reason:* why keep something useless
if we could as well
remove it? That would be an application of Ockham's razor principle if you
will.
It’s not useless. As I mentioned this is still in the model and we still support it. This
means that we need a way for advanced users to be able to create those pages (and using a
script to do so is worse than having a nice UI for it).
Thanks
-Vincent
Thanks,
Guillaume
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> > Guillaume
> >
> >
> > > > - However, I don't see any problem from a page being a nested
page
> > > > instead of being a terminal page
> > > >
> > > > In summary: why bother with terminal pages at all? I understand
> they're
> > > an
> > > > artefact from our pre-nested-spaces model, but do they really make
> sense
> > > > now? We could let existing terminal pages live on, but not remove
the
> > > > ability to create new ones even for admins.
> > > >
> > > > Am I missing something obvious?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > > Guillaume